Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD
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@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
I will also be watching to see how Pera handles all the pressure coming to him from this report.
Is there any pressure? I don't see any, that's the difference. I see no more pressure on him than I've put on Citron. How is Citron handling it? Not well. But what does that mean?
I say pressure because I've seen many analysts come out and seek an explanation or defense from Pera on the allegations. Again, we live in a "guilty until proven innocent" culture, so although unfair, it's something he's had to deal with. They held an investor day to address some of the allegations and what I took away from the analysis of it was that he didn't knock the accusations out of the water. When you're company is being accused very publicly as a fraud and the accuser is calling you out on CNBC, every major investing publication is talking about it, and you're the CEO of said public company, there's some "pressure" there as you have to protect the company image.
Citron, on the other hand, has gotten more attention and is now trying to capitalize by shorting another popular company Spotify. In the near term, they win on publicity that it brings them. I believe long term, they'll lose and be seen as you say, a scam and boy who cried wolf.
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
I say pressure because I've seen many analysts come out and seek an explanation or defense from Pera on the allegations.
But, any REAL analysts? Anyone is free to claim to be an analysit. It means nothing. I've seen nothing about this. I feel like there is no pressure, not real world pressure. Analysts don't matter, short sellers don't matter. It's just yahoos trying to get hits for their blogs or whatever.
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Citron, on the other hand, has gotten more attention and is now trying to capitalize by shorting another popular company Spotify. In the near term, they win on publicity that it brings them. I believe long term, they'll lose and be seen as you say, a scam and boy who cried wolf.
No, America doesn't work that way. No one remembers you long enough to point out that it was a scam. It's clearly a scam, look at his site, there's no question at all. He's not legit in any way. His audience isn't people who can afford to invest, it's people just looking to make noise.
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
When you're company is being accused very publicly as a fraud and the accuser is calling you out on CNBC, every major investing publication is talking about it, and you're the CEO of said public company, there's some "pressure" there as you have to protect the company image.
Yeah, but like I keep saying, I accused the company accusing him of fraud. No one cares.
I've not seen a single publication of merit talking about it. The company looks great, I think, that only clearly fraudulent outlets have been talking about it. What legit publication has made mention of it?
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@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
Exactly. Those things take very big as much time as running a company, and no one said he was running another company, just investing.
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@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
Exactly. Those things take very big as much time as running a company, and no one said he was running another company, just investing.
I imagine its healthier than most CEO hobbies...
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Here is Forbes' take on it: "Morningstar analyst Ilya Kundozerov, who has covered Ubiquiti for about a year and had the stock as a hold as of Aug. 29, told me: "The guy [Pera] doesn't pay much attention to the analysts. What he cares about is putting a good product out the door." Kundozerov said he doesn't think these allegations will have any long-term impact on the business."
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More from Forbes: "Ubiquiti does not have a marketing or sales department, to which Kundozerov said, “This is not the substantial evidence to call the company a fraud.”
Basically, Citron doesn't know business and just spouts off. Buffoons trying to get attention.
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Also worth noting, while the stock did drop after the fake report, it rebounded right back and has been unaffected by it. So I think that the news outlets are blowing smoke. The investors clearly don't have concerns here.
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Yeah its just a shame I didnt have any money available to put into Ubiquity when they dropped. Could have got some slightly cheaper stock. I am not worried about any of these allegations.
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@jmoore said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Yeah its just a shame I didnt have any money available to put into Ubiquity when they dropped. Could have got some slightly cheaper stock. I am not worried about any of these allegations.
Yup, I wonder if that isn't what Pera was hoping too
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@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
Haha no I wasn't kidding. Yes you can get super serious about biking, running, etc but for the majority of people, it's a hobby. It's something you do a few times a week after or before work for pleasure.
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@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
When you're company is being accused very publicly as a fraud and the accuser is calling you out on CNBC, every major investing publication is talking about it, and you're the CEO of said public company, there's some "pressure" there as you have to protect the company image.
Yeah, but like I keep saying, I accused the company accusing him of fraud. No one cares.
I've not seen a single publication of merit talking about it. The company looks great, I think, that only clearly fraudulent outlets have been talking about it. What legit publication has made mention of it?
CNBC isn't legit? Seeking Alpha isn't legit? MarketWatch isn't legit?
It's been discussed in the media by multiple outlets which is why I originally shared it here was to get some input and thoughts from those like myself who are consumers. It was a place to discuss it as the news unfolded.
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@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
Exactly. Those things take very big as much time as running a company, and no one said he was running another company, just investing.
Come on guys we're grasping here. Comparing hobbies and physical health to running a company?? Give me a break. And when you're a majority stakeholder of a company, you aren't just "investing". You're now a decision maker. How much time he will have to put into that may be small or large. I DON'T KNOW. I'm just saying if it required a good amount of time and focus, I could see where this COULD concern investors. If it doesn't concern you, then you aren't one of those investors.
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@jmoore said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Yeah its just a shame I didnt have any money available to put into Ubiquity when they dropped. Could have got some slightly cheaper stock. I am not worried about any of these allegations.
It was sitting between $45-50 for 6 months earlier this year, and this fraud accusation didn't even get it below $50. If you were going to buy, should have done it then.
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
Buying and running another company isn't comparable to jogging, mountain climbing, vacationing, or any of the other examples you used.
You're kidding right? you can easily dive into those sports as much as one can dive into running a company (especially mountain climbing).
Exactly. Those things take very big as much time as running a company, and no one said he was running another company, just investing.
Come on guys we're grasping here. Comparing hobbies and physical health to running a company?? Give me a break. And when you're a majority stakeholder of a company, you aren't just "investing". You're now a decision maker. How much time he will have to put into that may be small or large. I DON'T KNOW. I'm just saying if it required a good amount of time and focus, I could see where this COULD concern investors. If it doesn't concern you, then you aren't one of those investors.
Not grasping at all. When you can buy a company it's a hobby too. Grasping is what the whole topic is. A fake audit about a guy's investments and hobbies that is of no business to anyone.
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@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
When you're company is being accused very publicly as a fraud and the accuser is calling you out on CNBC, every major investing publication is talking about it, and you're the CEO of said public company, there's some "pressure" there as you have to protect the company image.
Yeah, but like I keep saying, I accused the company accusing him of fraud. No one cares.
I've not seen a single publication of merit talking about it. The company looks great, I think, that only clearly fraudulent outlets have been talking about it. What legit publication has made mention of it?
CNBC isn't legit? Seeking Alpha isn't legit? MarketWatch isn't legit?
It's been discussed in the media by multiple outlets which is why I originally shared it here was to get some input and thoughts from those like myself who are consumers. It was a place to discuss it as the news unfolded.
I can't speak about the other two... but CNBC - again I ask, you're kidding right? Like any of the other major new stations they are just click bait news. This story seemed like it would get some viewers so they showed it, I'm willing to bet they put any of their own effort into vetting any of the information provided by Citron.
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@dashrender said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@scottalanmiller said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
@zachary715 said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
When you're company is being accused very publicly as a fraud and the accuser is calling you out on CNBC, every major investing publication is talking about it, and you're the CEO of said public company, there's some "pressure" there as you have to protect the company image.
Yeah, but like I keep saying, I accused the company accusing him of fraud. No one cares.
I've not seen a single publication of merit talking about it. The company looks great, I think, that only clearly fraudulent outlets have been talking about it. What legit publication has made mention of it?
CNBC isn't legit? Seeking Alpha isn't legit? MarketWatch isn't legit?
It's been discussed in the media by multiple outlets which is why I originally shared it here was to get some input and thoughts from those like myself who are consumers. It was a place to discuss it as the news unfolded.
I can't speak about the other two... but CNBC - again I ask, you're kidding right? Like any of the other major new stations they are just click bait news. This story seemed like it would get some viewers so they showed it, I'm willing to bet they put any of their own effort into vetting any of the information provided by Citron.
CNBC is what the entire financial industry watches all day. Seriously, walk into the office of anyone who manages a few hundred million and up and you'll see it on. This is news because Citron picked Valient correctly (I made a @#$@ ton of money off of that stock).
SeekingAlpha has decent writers also (I don't agree with everything they post) but they are generally well respected in that sector.
This would be like someone in finance saying "Arstechnica, isn't a bullshit, clickbait news website"
- they have no expertise in this field, 2. they would be wrong.
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@storageninja said in Notorious Short-seller labels Ubiquiti Networks $UBNT as FRAUD:
CNBC is what the entire financial industry watches all day. Seriously, walk into the office of anyone who manages a few hundred million and up and you'll see it on.
A decade on Wall St. and seriously, no one in actual finance watches stuff like that. Maybe those consumer "financial advisers" that people see. But they are not considered part of the financial industry.
