Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016
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This thread inspired me...
https://mangolassi.it/topic/13083/was-it-the-last-it-guys-fault
Something HUGE to keep in mind in your current situation... you are not the IT manager. The partners are. You are providing them advice, but they are running IT. It is their decisions that you implement.
What does this mean for you? It means that the "IT guy" in the past was just following orders (or disobeying them) just like you, he was not the IT decision maker. The head(s) of IT are still there from when those mistakes were made and have not been replaced (and we assume also not chastised or even made aware of their role in the problems.) So their emotional response to problems in the past was to shoot the messenger, it sounds like, and ignore the fact that they were the ones mandating policy. Maybe he didn't follow orders well, who knows.
But what you know is that IT does not have a break here. The head(s) of IT have remained from then until now. There is continuity. If there are IT problems, the IT people who ultimately hold that departmental responsibility are the exact same people giving you crazy marching orders now.
That's a critical perspective for you... and for them.
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Sorry was engaged with user needs.
Honestly I don't think you could underestimate the way these guys want what they want, regardless of the counseling and leadership or cost containment/reduction before them.
I've been at much more pragmatic companies where there was dwindling revenue and stagnated growth.
However, I will ponder a return meeting. Wish I could sneak a camera in this, or live stream it here.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Sorry was engaged with user needs.
Or "poo flinging monkeys" as we decided to start calling them. PFM from now on.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Honestly I don't think you could underestimate the way these guys want what they want, regardless of the counseling and leadership or cost containment/reduction before them.
You can sum that up with the term "irrational" or possible "erratic."
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
I've been at much more pragmatic companies where there was dwindling revenue and stagnated growth.
In business, especially business with government entities, there is rarely a connection between competence and revenue. If your value is being a "member of the old boys club" for example, it likely makes no difference if you can do anything. Or if you are a doctor, you just pay to get your certification and you get jobs as a sort of government welfare system where unless you truly screw up, you are basically guaranteed a minimum salary that you have "purchased" from the government. Does not imply that you are a good doctor, a competent business person or even a functional adult.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
However, I will ponder a return meeting. Wish I could sneak a camera in this, or live stream it here.
Really the question is.... do you respect them enough to bother? Do you have the confidence in them to think that they can overcome their irrational emotional response, or do you feel that the effort to help them is too great and that they need to be treated more like children and just placated.
In reality, for the majority of the SMB, the later makes more sense. They have chosen to be the IT managers, once you have made your case and done your job, you have no further responsibility. All problems rest fully on their shoulders as the decision makers.
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And if it EVER goes down even for a second LOL. I don't know guys, I can't decide if another failed attempt is worth the strife it would cause me. Everyone here is happy and I am at a point where its just irrelevant.
It's akin to the saying "happy wife, happy life". I have left the writing on the while as to say "this is not at all what I recommend". I will have to ponder this a little further.
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Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
We don't use Office365, just the self-hosted service that includes it otherwise. Wouldn't want to run a local mail server. You however, have basically been given the instructions by the IT directors, so you have little choice in the matter.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
And if it EVER goes down even for a second LOL. I don't know guys, I can't decide if another failed attempt is worth the strife it would cause me. Everyone here is happy and I am at a point where its just irrelevant.
It's akin to the saying "happy wife, happy life". I have left the writing on the while as to say "this is not at all what I recommend". I will have to ponder this a little further.
Yup, give them what they want, not what they need. It's their business at the end of the day, not your job to push them to do thing well if they don't want to do things well.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
It's the most popular I think. Certainly not all. Some G Suite users, a few Zimbra. Some Zoho, too.
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@travisdh1 said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
We don't use Office365, just the self-hosted service that includes it otherwise. Wouldn't want to run a local mail server.
WETF? Can you translate that from tin foil hat to English?
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@scottalanmiller said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
It's the most popular I think. Certainly not all. Some G Suite users, a few Zimbra. Some Zoho, too.
It is hard to beat $4/user/month.
I mean I get paid to install things like this and I still do not recommend it, because it is not what is best for my client's business.
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@JaredBusch said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@scottalanmiller said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
It's the most popular I think. Certainly not all. Some G Suite users, a few Zimbra. Some Zoho, too.
It is hard to beat $4/user/month.
I mean I get paid to install things like this and I sitll do not recommend it, because it is not what is best for my client's business.
LOL, yeah, same here. SO much money to be made supporting Exchange if we could just bring ourselves to tell people it was okay to run (for normal business cases.)
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@scottalanmiller said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@JaredBusch said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@scottalanmiller said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
It's the most popular I think. Certainly not all. Some G Suite users, a few Zimbra. Some Zoho, too.
It is hard to beat $4/user/month.
I mean I get paid to install things like this and I sitll do not recommend it, because it is not what is best for my client's business.
LOL, yeah, same here. SO much money to be made supporting Exchange if we could just bring ourselves to tell people it was okay to run (for normal business cases.)
And if they'd accept the advice.
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@JaredBusch said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
I mean I get paid to install things like this and I still do not recommend it, because it is not what is best for my client's business.
That's really a good way to point out what a bad idea this likely is. Consultants who would get paid TO PUSH EXCHANGE can't do so on ethical grounds because they would normally only say it was okay to consider to make a quick buck of a naive client.
THis is a client so naive they are doing it to themselves!
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@JaredBusch said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@travisdh1 said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
Does everyone here pretty much use Office 365 for email, then?
We don't use Office365, just the self-hosted service that includes it otherwise. Wouldn't want to run a local mail server.
WETF? Can you translate that from tin foil hat to English?
Yeah, $.
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@travisdh1 what self hosted service?
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
@travisdh1 what self hosted service?
He doesn't have them.. that was the point of my querying WTF he was saying. He mixed his sentence up horribly.
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@magroover said in Moving from Exchange Online Plan 1 to In House Exchange 2016:
There are 3 partners, all of which are over 70, one is 83.
The prevailing response was "we don't do things cheap to save money, we don't cut corners". And then a ridiculous amount of speculation about who would hack our cloud based email accounts.This is the absolute worst kind of thinking known to mankind. There's a term for this, I think it's NIH, may be coupled with the IKEA effect. Correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a while since I've heard it and had to look it up quick before I lost my train of thought. This whole thing is almost the exact same scenario in which I heard the term, whether it's one of those or not.
That 50-year old thinking is insane and has no place in modern day business.
Do those owners have any idea how many millions and millions and millions and millions of dollars and thousands and thousands and thousands of collective man-hours that have gone in to security, and huge dedicated teams for every aspect of O365 email? Do they really believe their $3000 server and 100 man-hours will really be any more secure than the O365 email cloud? Do they think them and their employees are more skilled than the collective 1000's of employees working 24/7 to monitor, research, advance, grow, maintain, etc... the so-called O365 "cloud"?
I haven't read all 75 responses, but from what I seen, @JaredBusch pretty much hit the nail on the head regarding costs as well as other aspects.
If you have already gone over all of this stuff with management, and they STILL want you to do this in-house after everything... than do right, on the right equipment as others have suggested. They obviously have no regard to the monetary aspect of this, so it seems like you are free to spend whatever is needed to do it the right way.
