Is Microsoft Sliding Into Consumer Irrelevance?
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Chromebooks are low cost, low spec devices, which isn't an area Microsoft is even competing in, so comparing sales figures is meaningless.
What's important is that it is an area where Microsoft has been extremely aggressive for years and has failed. Microsoft tried to make a netbook OS, it tanked. They now are offering their OS for free on this hardware, but are getting few sales. This category is now the largest consumer computing category after phones. So the top two consumer categories are both being lost my Microsoft even though they are throwing tons of money and effort at winning those areas.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Plus, Windows still dominates the gaming market, and as long as that remains, their devices will still be relevant.
They do, that is true, but the rate at which they are losing ground there is unprecedented. It's their last stronghold and it is slipping fast.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
I think Windows still dominate overall sales, don't they?
Only if you eliminate the big categories and look solely and smaller niches like large format laptops and desktops. Overall, no, Windows is no longer the overall leader in consumer or business categories. Windows still leads in business, not consumer, traditional laptop and desktops.
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Oh. You got any figures? Who is leader in consumer computers now then?
Even if Windows computers & tablets don't dominate sales, I think you have to recognise that most people already have a Windows computer whilst tablets are relatively new. So you'd expect a massive intitial growth in tablet sales, followed by a tailing off as people are slow to replace their existing tablets (just like they are slow to replace their existing PCs).
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@scottalanmiller said:
Windows still leads in business, not consumer, traditional laptop and desktops.
Not in consumer laptops and desktops? What's leading there then?
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@Carnival-Boy said:
So you'd expect a massive intitial growth in tablet sales, followed by a tailing off as people are slow to replace their existing tablets (just like they are slow to replace their existing PCs).
I'd agree with the explosive growth, but I think the overall sales will stay high as well. I think this because of a few factors. 1 - they are or at least can be much cheaper than a laptop/desktop. 2 - as more services become available and easy to use on tablets, fewer people will replace their laptop/desktop and move solely to a tablet.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Oh. You got any figures? Who is leader in consumer computers now then?
Linux has been for some time. It dominates all major markets now. Has for a while. With the latest leap in Linux Chromebooks to the top of the charts for laptop sales, the largest consumer traditional category is going to Linux now too, not just the larger selling subsets of it. Linux actually took the low cost laptop market from Microsoft like six years ago, but this is moving more and more into the mainstream laptop market too.
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@Dashrender said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Windows still leads in business, not consumer, traditional laptop and desktops.
Not in consumer laptops and desktops? What's leading there then?
Linux. The one that we already see with the three top selling models this Christmas
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Even if Windows computers & tablets don't dominate sales, I think you have to recognise that most people already have a Windows computer whilst tablets are relatively new. So you'd expect a massive intitial growth in tablet sales, followed by a tailing off as people are slow to replace their existing tablets (just like they are slow to replace their existing PCs).
I agree, but what people are seeing is a huge surge of tablets replacing PCs, too. Don't forget that. That is a major trend. Microsoft is having not only issues holding onto the deployment of their OS to their primary market devices, but seeing their entire primary market evaporating as well. PCs are not just seeing longer cycles than every before, but they are being completely replaced by lower cost, simpler devices that don't run Windows and are replaced many times more frequently.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Linux has been for some time. It dominates all major markets now. Has for a while. With the latest leap in Linux Chromebooks to the top of the charts for laptop sales, the largest consumer traditional category is going to Linux now too, not just the larger selling subsets of it. Linux actually took the low cost laptop market from Microsoft like six years ago, but this is moving more and more into the mainstream laptop market too.
O rly? I'd need to see some stats on that! And not just Amazon sales.
All I could find is this from last September:
http://www.computerworld.com/article/2687742/mac-and-chromebook-sales-erode-windows-pcs-retail-share.html
That says Macs had 26% share, Windows 68.4% and Chromebooks a measly 4.5%. Now if Chromebooks have overtaken Windows in the 3 months since those figures were calculated then fair enough, but I think you've got you Linux Tinted Glasses on. -
@Carnival-Boy said:
http://www.computerworld.com/article/2687742/mac-and-chromebook-sales-erode-windows-pcs-retail-share.html
That says Macs had 26% share, Windows 68.4% and Chromebooks a measly 4.5%. Now if Chromebooks have overtaken Windows in the 3 months since those figures were calculated then fair enough, but I think you've got you Linux Tinted Glasses on.You'll notice that they conveniently left out entire categories, like laptops that were not Mac, Windows or Chromebook. The entire standard Linux category, the one that was leading the shipments of lower cost laptops not too long ago, was completely left out of that number.
Problem is, Linux sales are not reported through those "sales" channels, whereas Chromebooks are. Using the word "sales" or using "reported sales" is a common tactic by vendors like Microsoft to show market dominance even when they have a small piece of the market.
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@scottalanmiller said:
You'll notice that they conveniently left out entire categories, like laptops that were not Mac, Windows or Chromebook.
They're saying Mac, Windows and Chromebook have 98.9% market share, so I guess Linux laptops have somewhere between 0 and 1.1%.
I don't know a single person who has a Linux laptop. You're really saying that Linux laptops represent the majority of laptop sales and the media is just ignoring it? Exactly which "sales" channels are all these consumers buying their Linux laptops? Do you have any figures at all?
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We Consult with clients on new equipment here are NTG's stats for 2014:
Laptops:
Windows Laptops: 341
Chrome: 6
MacBooks: 97
Linux: You can order these through HP and yes we have offered them but Not One client even considers them as a real option. IT guys always ask us to look into them but bosses win on this one.Tablets:
Windows (this includes surfaces): 10
IOS: 62
Android: 10This is based on what clients requested for their environments. Not sure how many of these got ordered (as we do not resell this kind of hardware).
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@Carnival-Boy said:
I don't know a single person who has a Linux laptop. You're really saying that Linux laptops represent the majority of laptop sales and the media is just ignoring it?
You live in the UK. You are not likely to see what the majority of laptop purchases are. Most laptops are not purchases in the first world, where Windows is dominant.
I've seen the opposite, though, even in the US. I've only seen about one person purchase a Windows laptop in the last five years. Everything else has been Linux.
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@Minion-Queen said:
We Consult with clients on new equipment here are NTG's stats for 2014:
Laptops:
Windows Laptops: 341
Chrome: 6
MacBooks: 97
Linux: You can order these through HP and yes we have offered them but Not One client even considers them as a real option. IT guys always ask us to look into them but bosses win on this one.Tablets:
Windows (this includes surfaces): 10
IOS: 62
Android: 10This is based on what clients requested for their environments. Not sure how many of these got ordered (as we do not resell this kind of hardware).
Remember that I said that business use for those is the one spot where Windows still dominates. That's their one stronghold.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Exactly which "sales" channels are all these consumers buying their Linux laptops? Do you have any figures at all?
Most don't. Linux is often installed after purchase.
But Amazon is, I believe, the largest channel for sales of any type. By a huge margin. Alibaba is probably similar.
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The big thing has been for years that Netbooks, which are predominately Linux, became the main source of consumer PC buying some years ago. It has been, for some time, by not including all laptop sales in the pool that the numbers have been skewed to make Windows sales sound better than they are.
It's tough because huge percentages of the market don't use traditional form factors anymore so now there are all of these "soft" categories that people use to list what is and isn't purchased.
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@scottalanmiller said:
But Amazon is, I believe, the largest channel for sales of any type.
15 of the top 20 laptop sales on Amazon in the US are currently Windows, including the entire top 7.
http://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Computers-Accessories-Laptop/zgbs/pc/565108Just saying.....
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Just saying.....
Pretty much this. @scottalanmiller you are seriously mistaken on this. It may be true for what you have seen, but not for what I have seen in the consumer world.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Most don't. Linux is often installed after purchase.
Who are the people who are installing Linux after the sale? As others have mentioned, I don't personally know a single consumer who owns a laptop that they installed Linux on after they received it, or ordered a laptop with Linux pre-installed.
