Is it racist? I think it is.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
But I consider my race to be White -- not German, English, or Scottish.
I assume it's because I've grown up in the U.S. and have learned to base my race off of that.
Right. You grew up in a German dominated country and are mostly German (Scottish is celtic, all the rest are Germans) that reclassified German as white about 80 years ago and has tried to make a point of making their white population unified (mostly, we suspect, as a means of banding together to retain a majority of more closely associated races as other races are more racial "distant.") That's a standard cultural trend over time.
If you lived in those individual countries, you'd see things probably a bit differently. But I also grew up in America and my background is shockingly close. however, I grew up one generation outside of a Swiss enclave and my family definitely didn't see ourselves as any closer to British as to Hispanic. Both were "other races". Not in a negative way, just "not Swiss". I grew up as Swiss German (not Swiss French as many are) with some Dutch and Scottish as "seasoning."
Both approaches exist commonly in the US. You get loads of people who see themselves as "American." But my wife's family is Italian and they'd never say American, they are absolutely Italian in every sense. Even though some of her family has been here since the Mayflower.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
I think that it's important to clarify that what you identify as and race are not the same things.
I can identify by nationality, ethnicity, or race. They are not same things.
You may identify by your ethnicity (Scottish for example), but your race may be White. (as an example, I don't know you)
Nationality is wholly different.
My nationality is American. That's clear cut. Your passport tells you this. It says nothing about you as a person. It's a legal thing.
Race is based on your DNA. It's who you are that no one can control. My race is predominantly, by no small margin, Swiss German. You can identify that by DNA. The chart you showed from 23 & Me or Ancenstry or whatever, is your racial information and nothing but racial. It can't determine anything else.
Ethnicity is your upbringing and culture. So for example, I was raised in a heavily Dutch influences, Swiss household. So my ethnicity is more heavily skewed towards Dutch than my DNA would suggest. But my ethnicity is also Swiss and Dutch.
Your race can never be changed. Your ethnicity is influenced by your life. So if I had been adopted by a family in Bogota and I was raised there as a local. My ethnicity would be Colombian. but my race would always be Swiss.
My kids are Swiss Italian by race. But heavily hispanic by ethnicity. Not fully, but partially whereas I am not.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You may identify by your ethnicity (Scottish for example), but your race may be White.
Most people identify by their race, not their ethnicity. Or some combination. For example by race my wife is Italian and Irish. But by ethnicity she is just Italian.
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A great example of intra-racial racism is in common slurs. For example...
In Quebec, to be someone stupid is to be a newfie. Newfie is a racial slur against the slightly different racial group from Newfoundland. But it's been a slur so long, many people don't realize that that is what they are saying.
Or you might use the term vandal or vandalize. A racial slur against some Germans. But it is mostly used by other Germans. It's used by northern Germans as a slur against ones from the south. But as racial groups, they are separated by many thousands of years.
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@scottalanmiller said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
Arabs could be anti-Jewish
That would be religious / cultural (ethno-religious?) discrimination or prejudice.
@scottalanmiller said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
Jews could be anti-Arab
That would be language / cultural discrimination or prejudice.
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Race is a categorization based on shared physical traits. (black, white, asian, indigenous)
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
So what race is someone who is mixed?
They get to choose... How does that even work?
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@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
So what race is someone who is mixed?
They get to choose... How does that even work?
Example?
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
So what race is someone who is mixed?
They get to choose... How does that even work?
Example?
Someone who is white and black. They almost always choose black. Why? How do they even have a choice?
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
That would be religious / cultural (ethno-religious?) discrimination or prejudice.
It's also a race. MANY Jews are not culturally or religiously homogenous.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
Jews could be anti-ArabThat would be language / cultural discrimination or prejudice.
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Race is a categorization based on shared physical traits. (black, white, asian, indigenous)
Exactly. Jew and Arab differ only on DNA, not on anything else. I think you are thinking of Judaism and Islam. Those are not traits of the DNA.
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@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
Yes, but I'm only using DNA.
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@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
So what race is someone who is mixed?
They get to choose... How does that even work?
Example?
Someone who is white and black. They almost always choose black. Why? How do they even have a choice?
They don't, when you "choose" you are choosing your ethnicity.
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@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
So what race is someone who is mixed?
They get to choose... How does that even work?
Example?
Someone who is white and black. They almost always choose black. Why? How do they even have a choice?
I don't know how to explain it well without sounding racist myself, but they are all just objective truths, so take it how you want. It's more-so about the physical appearance than anything.
For example, if someone is White and Asian, then of course they will likely have the physical appearances of both White and Asian. They might say White, they might say Asian. They might say they are White & Asian. Depending on the country this person is in or from, they may say they are Asian-American.
Same with your example regarding White and Black.
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@scottalanmiller said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Obsolesce said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
You are mistaking ancestry, ethnicity, culture, religion, nationality, and linguistic group with race.
Which of those you use to identify with is your choice. But are all different things.
Yes, but I'm only using DNA.
Ancestry is what DNA most closely matches.
Race is more rooted in societal perceptions and classifications rather than strict genetic distinctions.
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There is one example.
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@scottalanmiller said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
The world has always seen Europe alone as having about seven major races... Celtic, German, Slavic, Hellenic, Latin, Iberian, and Magyar plus the tiny race that is in Finland, Estonia and the Basque country.
This is ridiculous
I am from Europe and I do not know or heard anyone talking that these are "seven major races".
Whole Europe is (natively) of White/Caucasian race and I never heard anyone calling Slavic od Hellenic, for example, as a race.
Celtic, Slavic German... are groups of languages, not race or DNA. -
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
There is one example.
It is geo blocked in my country.
But I do not find it racist
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@Mario-Jakovina said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
There is one example.
It is geo blocked in my country.
But I do not find it racistShould we call it unnecessarily discriminatory (Instead of racist?)
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@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@Mario-Jakovina said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
@CCWTech said in Is it racist? I think it is.:
There is one example.
It is geo blocked in my country.
But I do not find it racistShould we call it unnecessarily discriminatory (Instead of racist?)
Let me put it this way.
If you would have said something more like:
"The website I'm trying to go to is only geo-blocking every spanish-speaking country. Is it just me or do they have a prejudice against spanish-speaking people?"
Or,
"This website is blocking every country in the world except the U.S., and their phone support also said it's due to the owners of the service having a huge prejudice against all non-U.S. countries."
That'd make WAY more sense, and something I could even get on board with, providing there aren't any technical reasons that make much more sense such as those I listed initially.
