5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available
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@dafyre said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
That the conversation rate to paying customer was so low as to make it non viable?
Likely, and the need for that conversion is the issue. You need a product that doesn't care about that.
Yeah I need all software I install on my systems to act as silent bitcoin miners that send the coin to the developers wallet . . .
That's not a bad idea, ha ha.
The FogProject has this built into their system, you have to enable it though if you want to contribute to them.
But it is there.
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@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
... but I also ask - why did 5Nines kill their free product?
Wasn't open source. Only existed as a loss leader, not as a value add to humanity. No gift economy effect.
damn it - I did mean to mention that so it would be a non starter.
XOA was clearly having issues - it was not a gift eco setup though.
It is, XO is gift economy. XOA is just monetizing on people who want support. Nothing non-gift about that. Requires time and resources per person, so there is a charge.
I'm guessing XO will die if the dev's can't earn enough on the support side with XOA.
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All you need to do is have Hyper-V Manager, PowerShell, FCM, and Veeam Monitor Free open at the same time. Once they are open, it's just as efficient as doing it through 5nine. I don't care either way. If I wasn't as experienced then I'd prefer 5nine more I guess. There's other things that make 5nine great that those other tools don't do like templates and such... but whatever. I'm not too effected by this change.
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@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
... but I also ask - why did 5Nines kill their free product?
Wasn't open source. Only existed as a loss leader, not as a value add to humanity. No gift economy effect.
damn it - I did mean to mention that so it would be a non starter.
XOA was clearly having issues - it was not a gift eco setup though.
It is, XO is gift economy. XOA is just monetizing on people who want support. Nothing non-gift about that. Requires time and resources per person, so there is a charge.
I'm guessing XO will die if the dev's can't earn enough on the support side with XOA.
I doubt that very much. It's open source.
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@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@Dashrender said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
... but I also ask - why did 5Nines kill their free product?
Wasn't open source. Only existed as a loss leader, not as a value add to humanity. No gift economy effect.
damn it - I did mean to mention that so it would be a non starter.
XOA was clearly having issues - it was not a gift eco setup though.
It is, XO is gift economy. XOA is just monetizing on people who want support. Nothing non-gift about that. Requires time and resources per person, so there is a charge.
I'm guessing XO will die if the dev's can't earn enough on the support side with XOA.
That is a real concern I have as well. That it will just disappear. The dev team has a very odd business approach, where they make it difficult for anyone to justify the cost monthly for support, when you can do everything with the open source version with community support.
By simply changing the pricing model to be a buy in and lower monthly cost, they'd have a huge uptick in customers.
Yet there is this constant issue that XS is such a tiny community compared to everything else that keeps getting repeated.
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By making XOA affordable for businesses (and IT to sell) I'm sure there would be a uptick in customers.
But the cost is staggering in comparison to other solutions (which is mostly Backup only) that many people are looking at. $6000 a year for all features and developer support would be comparable to paying for ESXi support year after year.
It's unjustifiable.
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I even asked the folks at XO, instead of the Ferrari edition at $500/mo, why not for less, offer a Backup/DR version that had just those features - backup & replication (no self service, no init etc)..that's a SKU IT folks can sell to their clients
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@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
That is a real concern I have as well. That it will just disappear.
Unlikely. There is big money on the table for someone to pick up and support that code base. I'd say 80% chance of protection based on that alone. If they went under, I'd stake it at 20% chance that I'd be involved in picking up the code base. Certainly something I'd strongly consider.
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@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
The dev team has a very odd business approach, where they make it difficult for anyone to justify the cost monthly for support, when you can do everything with the open source version with community support.
Yup, if it was me running the show (with the benefits of American style financing) I'd eliminate XOA off the bat, go to straight XO, roll everything in, make it a Snap deployment and only sell support.
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@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
Yet there is this constant issue that XS is such a tiny community compared to everything else that keeps getting repeated.
That's probably the first development effort I'd put resources on, making it no longer tied to XenServer. And change the name to reflect that.
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@FATeknollogee said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I even asked the folks at XO, instead of the Ferrari edition at $500/mo, why not for less, offer a Backup/DR version that had just those features - backup & replication (no self service, no init etc)..that's a SKU IT folks can sell to their clients
I did, too.
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@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@FATeknollogee said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I even asked the folks at XO, instead of the Ferrari edition at $500/mo, why not for less, offer a Backup/DR version that had just those features - backup & replication (no self service, no init etc)..that's a SKU IT folks can sell to their clients
I did, too.
Did they take your advice? (where is that sarcasm emoji when you need it)
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I asked Olivier himself and he said it was cost prohibitive for him to do so.
Which is a lot like saying "It cost us to much to take your money"
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@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I asked Olivier himself and he said it was cost prohibitive for him to do so.
Which is a lot like saying "It cost us to much to take your money"
Ha, KVM is looking pretty good these days.
Someone eventually will have an "XOA" style offering for KVM. -
@FATeknollogee said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@FATeknollogee said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I even asked the folks at XO, instead of the Ferrari edition at $500/mo, why not for less, offer a Backup/DR version that had just those features - backup & replication (no self service, no init etc)..that's a SKU IT folks can sell to their clients
I did, too.
Did they take your advice? (where is that sarcasm emoji when you need it)
Nope
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@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I asked Olivier himself and he said it was cost prohibitive for him to do so.
Which is a lot like saying "It cost us to much to take your money"
It's more that they are in Europe and have European financing and they have existing customers and costs. All things that don't encumber a new company taking over if they fail. This isn't helpful for them as a vendor, but it is helpful for customers to have faith in the product. Someone taking over the code base doesn't have that risk and can do things completely differently.
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@FATeknollogee said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
@DustinB3403 said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
I asked Olivier himself and he said it was cost prohibitive for him to do so.
Which is a lot like saying "It cost us to much to take your money"
Ha, KVM is looking pretty good these days.
Someone eventually will have an "XOA" style offering for KVM.I know someone talking about this, too.
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I mean, I took his installation steps, cleaned them up, made a simple installation process, scott scripted it, and it's been in development (with an updater) since then.
I know at least 20 people who have messaged me directly or through ML/SW saying "OMG thank you all I needed was backup and basic management capabilities but couldn't justify the cost"
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@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
Ha, KVM is looking pretty good these days.
Someone eventually will have an "XOA" style offering for KVM.I know someone talking about this, too.
Is it in beta yet (maybe alpha)?
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@scottalanmiller said in 5Nine Free Hyper-V Manager No Long Available:
It's more that they are in Europe and have European financing and they have existing customers and costs. All things that don't encumber a new company taking over if they fail. This isn't helpful for them as a vendor, but it is helpful for customers to have faith in the product. Someone taking over the code base doesn't have that risk and can do things completely differently.
The point is still that even if they created different pricing models and migrated their existing customers off that they would be able to grow more easily.
Flat out saying it "cost to much to take your money" is literally turning customers away.
