Stolen laptop advice.
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So, this is an HR question rather than IT.
We have had several instances in the past year where people have left their laptop in their vehicle and it has been stolen. We don't have anything proprietary on the laptops so the data on it is of no concern, I'm just curious what policy your company has when it comes to equipment being stolen (and having to be replaced) from an employee because they didn't secure it. i.e. leave it in their vehicle at a hotel.
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We have a policy in place where the laptops are encrypted, no matter what, there is a power on password at BIOS, so if the device is stolen, it's rather useless the password is on the device.
We report all thefts to the police, and internal HR.
We also track with Meraki (not that it matters if the laptop can't be turned on).
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Let me clarify, I don't care about the data or the laptop itself, I'm just curious what policies ya'll have for negligence of company equipment.
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It varies company to company. My current company has no policy in place which drives me nuts. Locking the device is great but someone walking by and breaking a window isn't going to know that. I'd write them up for it and put documentation behind it. Then it should be taken out of their bonus. If you screw with peoples money they change their behavior.
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Haha... my company doesn't have a policy, but want to put one in place and they asked me for advice (not my job, but they trust me on stuff) ... so I thought I would ask and see what other companies do.
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I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
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Our policy reflects the IT policies in place, and asset management policy that we have. Asset policy quoted below.
I am checking out the above listed equipment from ___________. I understand that my signature and initials on this agreement will be required before I am allowed to check out the equipment. I also agree that I am responsible for maintaining the equipment in a safe manner and returning it to ___________ in accordance with the terms of this agreement. My initials along with the initials of the person who "Checked-Out By" confirm that all of the above items where checked out in my possession. I understand that the above listed devices cannot be transferred to another employee without express consent from the _____________ Department. I agree to properly care for, maintain, and protect from theft the above devices. Such care includes, but is not limited to: storing the devices in a safe place away from moisture, heat, excessive dust, etc., setting the computer up in an area similar to an office atmosphere, locking the device at night, etc. I agree to return the devices listed above to _________________ at the end of my assignment. My failure to return the above devices as agreed herein can result in disciplinary action against me. I therefore agree that I will be personally responsible for loss or damage to the equipment occurring as a result of my own negligence or failure to abide by the terms of this agreement. -
@brianlittlejohn said in Stolen laptop advice.:
Let me clarify, I don't care about the data or the laptop itself, I'm just curious what policies ya'll have for negligence of company equipment.
Basically, if they keep doing it, you fire them. There is nothing else to be done.
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@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
Then it should be taken out of their bonus. If you screw with peoples money they change their behavior.
Yes, it makes them report you to the state attorney general's office for theft as that is a crime in the US. You cannot take company equipment costs out of an employee's pay. That's very, very illegal and unethical and will get you in a lot of hot water.
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@brianlittlejohn said in Stolen laptop advice.:
Haha... my company doesn't have a policy, but want to put one in place and they asked me for advice (not my job, but they trust me on stuff) ... so I thought I would ask and see what other companies do.
Legally nothing to do. You can't make them pay for it (otherwise you'd force employees to transport gold bars in their own vehicles and if they get stolen you'd just make the employees pay for it... which obviously isn't ethical.)
It's no different than a restaurant forcing a waitress to pay for customers who run without paying.... it's illegal and is literally just the business robbing the waitress themselves.
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@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
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@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@brianlittlejohn said in Stolen laptop advice.:
Let me clarify, I don't care about the data or the laptop itself, I'm just curious what policies ya'll have for negligence of company equipment.
Basically, if they keep doing it, you fire them. There is nothing else to be done.
This. I've only had one incident in the last few years where someone left a laptop in the boot of their car overnight and it got stolen. I believe they got a telling off and told not to do it again. We don't have a policy, which suits me, as I prefer the employer-employee relationship to be a bit less formal and a bit more based on trust and common sense rather than rules and regulations.
If people are persistently negligent then they're unlikely to be good employees generally, so it's worth firing them anyway. If they don't care about looking after their laptops, they're unlikely to care about looking after their customers and colleagues either.
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@Carnival-Boy said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@brianlittlejohn said in Stolen laptop advice.:
Let me clarify, I don't care about the data or the laptop itself, I'm just curious what policies ya'll have for negligence of company equipment.
Basically, if they keep doing it, you fire them. There is nothing else to be done.
This. I've only had one incident in the last few years where someone left a laptop in the boot of their car overnight and it got stolen. I believe they got a telling off and told not to do it again. We don't have a policy, which suits me, as I prefer the employer-employee relationship to be a bit less formal and a bit more based on trust and common sense rather than rules and regulations.
If people are persistently negligent then they're unlikely to be good employees generally, so it's worth firing them anyway. If they don't care about looking after their laptops, they're unlikely to care about looking after their customers and colleagues either.
I totally agree here. Accidents are going to happen and if you want people taking equipment home you have to accept risk with that. If you want employees to accept that risk, why would any employee ever take anything home? I'd just tell the office to shove it and I won't take on risk for work. That would make no sense. It's the company getting work out of me by me taking equipment home.
How... if it was not my job and I wasn't paid but I requested to take home a projector to use at my kids' birthday party and I was literally just borrowing company gear for personal use, that would be different and I should be allowed to request responsibility in exchange for getting to borrow stuff. If that is the case, it's not work related and I could be charged for damage.
But if I'm helping the company out and bad things happen on my watch, that's not my problem. If I was a bad steward, well maybe I shouldn't be allowed to do that. If I'm always a bad steward, I probably shouldn't be kept around or at least my responsibilities should reflect what I'm able to do versus what I'm not able to do.
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@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
I don't agree with this. That said, if the company doesn't want to be responsible for the equipment, they should require tha the staff provide their own equipment for the job. You're required to have shirt/shoes, etc why not required to provide your own computer - problem solved.
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@Dashrender said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
I don't agree with this. That said, if the company doesn't want to be responsible for the equipment, they should require tha the staff provide their own equipment for the job. You're required to have shirt/shoes, etc why not required to provide your own computer - problem solved.
Who would be liable if the laptop is damaged during work hours? Installing AV suites, etc? That's an odd situation you would create I think.
@scottalanmiller I'm honestly not sure how they did it at the hospital. That was years ago. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong.
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@Dashrender said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
I don't agree with this. That said, if the company doesn't want to be responsible for the equipment, they should require tha the staff provide their own equipment for the job. You're required to have shirt/shoes, etc why not required to provide your own computer - problem solved.
You don't agree that this is the law or you don't agree with the law? You feel that the company should be able to force risk on you and then charge you when things you may have no control over happen?
That's literally theft and extortion. And as a trained manager, it was drilled into us how illegal this was. Working in a large corporation, they always made it very clear that charging someone for things like this wasn't "like" theft but was actually stealing from the employee.
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@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@Dashrender said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
I don't agree with this. That said, if the company doesn't want to be responsible for the equipment, they should require tha the staff provide their own equipment for the job. You're required to have shirt/shoes, etc why not required to provide your own computer - problem solved.
Who would be liable if the laptop is damaged during work hours? Installing AV suites, etc? That's an odd situation you would create I think.
@scottalanmiller I'm honestly not sure how they did it at the hospital. That was years ago. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong.
Same with it being stolen from an employee's car. What if it is stolen from the office? Why not charge the employee for that? What about the cost of AV to protect the employee? Or the cost of managing the laptop? Or the cost of their chair or desk? Why not just charge employee's to come to work?
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@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@Dashrender said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
I think the hospital I worked for made you sign a contract making you financially responsible for whatever device you were using (only laptops and ipads etc).
That contract would be invalid. It's illegal to force someone to sign away their US employment rights. It's the same as you can't make someone sign away their right to minimum wage. Just making someone sign that shows bad faith and could be used in court to show that the hospital had planned for theft, not just done it as an emotional reaction showing intentional coercion and intent to defraud or extort.
I don't agree with this. That said, if the company doesn't want to be responsible for the equipment, they should require tha the staff provide their own equipment for the job. You're required to have shirt/shoes, etc why not required to provide your own computer - problem solved.
Who would be liable if the laptop is damaged during work hours? Installing AV suites, etc? That's an odd situation you would create I think.
@scottalanmiller I'm honestly not sure how they did it at the hospital. That was years ago. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong.
Same with it being stolen from an employee's car. What if it is stolen from the office? Why not charge the employee for that? What about the cost of AV to protect the employee? Or the cost of managing the laptop? Or the cost of their chair or desk? Why not just charge employee's to come to work?
Yeah I understand what you mean. It's a slippery slope.
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@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller I'm honestly not sure how they did it at the hospital. That was years ago. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong.
Americans often don't know their employment rights and lots of companies use extortion to threaten workers with black listing, lawsuits or whatever to violate their rights. It's extremely common in the US to have employment rights violated and employees led to believe that they have no recourse.
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@scottalanmiller said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@wirestyle22 said in Stolen laptop advice.:
@scottalanmiller I'm honestly not sure how they did it at the hospital. That was years ago. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong.
Americans often don't know their employment rights and lots of companies use extortion to threaten workers with black listing, lawsuits or whatever to violate their rights. It's extremely common in the US to have employment rights violated and employees led to believe that they have no recourse.
That is my fault for not researching it if that did indeed happen. I'm honestly not sure.
