Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution
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Yeah sounds like EMC very well may have been making an expectation for us then since we spend so much with them on VMAX, Unity VSA etc.
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@Jason Expectation -- or exception?
But either way, it'd be worth a price comparison of the two if considering the paid EMC product.
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@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@scottalanmiller said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
You can also use EMC ScaleIO for free with your own hardware if you use the community for support https://www.emc.com/products-solutions/trial-software-download/scaleio.htm (or you can buy the software or pre-configured dell servers with it).
For commercial use, too? How did I not know that they had opened this up?
Yes, the EULA has no restrictions on that. Their marketing terms of course try to convey you should " When you are ready to purchase a ScaleIO software license for full production use and maintenance, contact a Sales Associate" but the EULA has nothing requiring it.
This isn't true. Don't get yourself intro trouble with misuse! You can't use it for production and you have to let EMC know you evaluate with a prod use in mind. That's EVERYTHING but free... IMHO.
https://www.emc.com/content/terms/eula-scaleio.htm
E. “Internal Business Purposes” means an internal (non-commercial) Use for the purpose(s) of testing and demonstrating the features of the Software, and not for Customer product development, product testing, or other Customer research and development or commercial purposes.
You are reading that incorrectly. That's just definitions, not the terms. Our EMC rep already confirmed it to us.
I read everything correctly. 3A grants you rights to use sofware for "Internal Use". Internal Use means non-commercial.
I don't know what EMC sales rep verbally told you. Talk to your lawyers with EULA in hand, it's public.
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@dafyre said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@scottalanmiller said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
You can also use EMC ScaleIO for free with your own hardware if you use the community for support https://www.emc.com/products-solutions/trial-software-download/scaleio.htm (or you can buy the software or pre-configured dell servers with it).
For commercial use, too? How did I not know that they had opened this up?
Yes, the EULA has no restrictions on that. Their marketing terms of course try to convey you should " When you are ready to purchase a ScaleIO software license for full production use and maintenance, contact a Sales Associate" but the EULA has nothing requiring it.
This isn't true. Don't get yourself intro trouble with misuse! You can't use it for production and you have to let EMC know you evaluate with a prod use in mind. That's EVERYTHING but free... IMHO.
https://www.emc.com/content/terms/eula-scaleio.htm
E. “Internal Business Purposes” means an internal (non-commercial) Use for the purpose(s) of testing and demonstrating the features of the Software, and not for Customer product development, product testing, or other Customer research and development or commercial purposes.
You are reading that incorrectly. That's just definitions, not the terms. Our EMC rep already confirmed it to us.
Look at 3 A... "License Grant. Subject to Customer's compliance with this Agreement, EMC grants to Customer a non-exclusive, world-wide, royalty free, full-paid, terminable, and nontransferable license, under EMC’s copyrights, to Use: (i) the Software for the Customer's Internal Business Purposes;"
Combine that with Definition E...
E. “Internal Business Purposes” means an internal (non-commercial) Use for the purpose(s) of testing and demonstrating the features of the Software, and not for Customer product development, product testing, or other Customer research and development or commercial purposes.
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@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@scottalanmiller said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
You can also use EMC ScaleIO for free with your own hardware if you use the community for support https://www.emc.com/products-solutions/trial-software-download/scaleio.htm (or you can buy the software or pre-configured dell servers with it).
For commercial use, too? How did I not know that they had opened this up?
Yes, the EULA has no restrictions on that. Their marketing terms of course try to convey you should " When you are ready to purchase a ScaleIO software license for full production use and maintenance, contact a Sales Associate" but the EULA has nothing requiring it.
This isn't true. Don't get yourself intro trouble with misuse! You can't use it for production and you have to let EMC know you evaluate with a prod use in mind. That's EVERYTHING but free... IMHO.
https://www.emc.com/content/terms/eula-scaleio.htm
E. “Internal Business Purposes” means an internal (non-commercial) Use for the purpose(s) of testing and demonstrating the features of the Software, and not for Customer product development, product testing, or other Customer research and development or commercial purposes.
You are reading that incorrectly. That's just definitions, not the terms. Our EMC rep already confirmed it to us.
I read everything correctly. 3A grants you rights to use sofware for "Internal Use". Internal Use means non-commercial.
I don't know what EMC sales rep verbally told you. Talk to your lawyers with EULA in hand, it's public.
Doesn't matter we have the Email from EMC. That is permission to use it.
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In before the EMC reps in question get told off for violating their own EULA and they inform you, you can't use it in production anymore, however you can get a 5% discount from the full paid license and a jar of cookies:)
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@ardeyn said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
In before the EMC reps in question get told off for violating their own EULA and they inform you, you can't use it in production anymore, however you can get a 5% discount from the full paid license and a jar of cookies:)
@Jason can have the 5% discount... Me and @ardeyn will take all the cookies.
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@dafyre I'm absolutely on board with that!
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@ardeyn said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
In before the EMC reps in question get told off for violating their own EULA and they inform you, you can't use it in production anymore, however you can get a 5% discount from the full paid license and a jar of cookies:)
They can't retro actively change it. They could prevent us from upgrading sure.
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@Jason The thing is (I might be wrong though)
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company". This way you are still violating the EULA. This may not be immediately noticeable while you work with the aforementioned reps, however if you were to reach out to support and they will see what kind of license you are using, there may be trouble.
That being said, I am not sure it's the case, it just sounds like a possible course of action. -
@ardeyn said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason The thing is (I might be wrong though)
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company". This way you are still violating the EULA. This may not be immediately noticeable while you work with the aforementioned reps, however if you were to reach out to support and they will see what kind of license you are using, there may be trouble.
That being said, I am not sure it's the case, it just sounds like a possible course of action.The emails do not include such a disclaimer. So that would not apply. We have a great legal team anyway. They've seen it.
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@Jason Then you should be good, apart from upgrading, as you mentioned. However, this definitely looks like a one off.
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@ardeyn said
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company".
Any lawyer who has half a brain cell has proven in court that those email disclaimers are worth nothing. I admire the companies who still use them though.
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@Breffni-Potter said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@ardeyn said
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company".
Any lawyer who has half a brain cell has proven in court that those email disclaimers are worth nothing. I admire the companies who still use them though.
Yes, email disclaimers are completely non-enforceable and has been proven in court more than once.
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@Breffni-Potter said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@ardeyn said
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company".
Any lawyer who has half a brain cell has proven in court that those email disclaimers are worth nothing. I admire the companies who still use them though.
That's not the disclaimer that he means. You are correct in what you are picturing. But what @Jason is talking about is completely different and is totally legal and useful.
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@scottalanmiller said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Breffni-Potter said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@ardeyn said
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company".
Any lawyer who has half a brain cell has proven in court that those email disclaimers are worth nothing. I admire the companies who still use them though.
That's not the disclaimer that he means. You are correct in what you are picturing. But what @Jason is talking about is completely different and is totally legal and useful.
I do not know what thread you are reading, but the only disclaimer mentioned was not by Jason. This has nothing to do with anything Jason is talking about.
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@ardeyn said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason The thing is (I might be wrong though)
Pretty much any rep of any company works with a disclaimer, that sounds along the lines of "Any opinions expressed in this communication are not necessarily those of the company". This way you are still violating the EULA. This may not be immediately noticeable while you work with the aforementioned reps, however if you were to reach out to support and they will see what kind of license you are using, there may be trouble.
That being said, I am not sure it's the case, it just sounds like a possible course of action.THis post, and these do work. It's not the same as the disclaimers saying that if this is for the wrong recipient or forcing you to do something when you receive an email. It's saying that the email communications is not official and is meaningless. It also makes ALL sales from them worthless as well, of course.
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Thanks for all the input on this peeps.
A few years ago if I was doing this refresh and a rep/sales man/someone said to me for HA you need 3 hosts + SAN I would of just signed the order.But now thanks to Spiceworks and Mangolassi communities I can call BS! and offer a different way of thinking
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@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@scottalanmiller said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
@Jason said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
You can also use EMC ScaleIO for free with your own hardware if you use the community for support https://www.emc.com/products-solutions/trial-software-download/scaleio.htm (or you can buy the software or pre-configured dell servers with it).
For commercial use, too? How did I not know that they had opened this up?
Yes, the EULA has no restrictions on that. Their marketing terms of course try to convey you should " When you are ready to purchase a ScaleIO software license for full production use and maintenance, contact a Sales Associate" but the EULA has nothing requiring it.
This isn't true. Don't get yourself intro trouble with misuse! You can't use it for production and you have to let EMC know you evaluate with a prod use in mind. That's EVERYTHING but free... IMHO.
https://www.emc.com/content/terms/eula-scaleio.htm
E. “Internal Business Purposes” means an internal (non-commercial) Use for the purpose(s) of testing and demonstrating the features of the Software, and not for Customer product development, product testing, or other Customer research and development or commercial purposes.
You are reading that incorrectly. That's just definitions, not the terms. Our EMC rep already confirmed it to us.
I read everything correctly. 3A grants you rights to use sofware for "Internal Use". Internal Use means non-commercial.
I don't know what EMC sales rep verbally told you. Talk to your lawyers with EULA in hand, it's public.
Doesn't matter we have the Email from EMC. That is permission to use it.
If there's no financial interest from the person who told that he won't show up in the court, it would be you for EULA violation and EMC lawyers. When you install product you accept EULA and THAT is what you agree on when you use the licensed software. E-mail = junk.
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@KOOLER said in Hardware refresh and Selling the Solution:
If there's no financial interest from the person who told that he won't show up in the court, it would be you for EULA violation and EMC lawyers. When you install product you accept EULA and THAT is what you agree on when you use the licensed software. E-mail = junk.
The Emails are still there the person does not have to show up in court. When did you become a lawyer? We have a very good legal team. They have all looked at it. Heck we even have a modified EULA from Microsoft with our EA as our legal team did not like some of their normal verbiage, it's not the same one you install the software with, the fact it what a company says, signs etc outside of that EULA can still modify it. Like it or not that's how it is.
