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    Backup File Server to DAS

    IT Discussion
    das storage backup file server
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    • IT-ADMINI
      IT-ADMIN
      last edited by

      when i see SAN : money falling from heaven, i remove the SAN from my list lol

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • scottalanmillerS
        scottalanmiller @IT-ADMIN
        last edited by

        @IT-ADMIN said:

        what do you think about this

        I think that you need to work on identifying when someone is in marketing or sales rather than an IT professional. Spiceworks is completely the wrong place to be getting that kind of information. They are only there to sell things for the vendors who sponsor them, nothing else. Why would marketing interns have any idea what a SAN even means?

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        • IT-ADMINI
          IT-ADMIN @scottalanmiller
          last edited by

          @scottalanmiller said:

          Why would you get information like that from someone not in IT?

          SW not IT 😳

          scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • scottalanmillerS
            scottalanmiller @IT-ADMIN
            last edited by

            @IT-ADMIN said:

            but it looks like this course not having exact information

            There were some complaints about their using "Sam" too to confuse people into thinking that they paid "SAM" to make sure that the information was correct. Because obviously this wasn't checked by anyone.

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            • scottalanmillerS
              scottalanmiller @IT-ADMIN
              last edited by

              @IT-ADMIN said:

              @scottalanmiller said:

              Why would you get information like that from someone not in IT?

              SW not IT 😳

              Of course it isn't IT. Why would you associate the two? They've never claimed to be anything of the sort.

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • scottalanmillerS
                scottalanmiller
                last edited by

                Spiceworks has always been completely open and honest about being a marketing company and nothing else. They are ad people, and very good at it. They are run by marketing people, their hire all marketing people. They only have just enough IT staff to support the hundreds of marketing and sales people that they have. There is no secret there. No different than any other marketing firm.

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                • IT-ADMINI
                  IT-ADMIN
                  last edited by

                  oh, now i see, really i was ignorant, i trusted SW

                  scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • DustinB3403D
                    DustinB3403
                    last edited by

                    The badges should only be done for laughs. You gain nothing from having them. Sure you might ween some information out of their "University" that you hadn't known before. But take it with a huge grain of salt.

                    scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • scottalanmillerS
                      scottalanmiller @IT-ADMIN
                      last edited by

                      @IT-ADMIN said:

                      oh, now i see, really i was ignorant, i trusted SW

                      Trusting them as marketers is fine. Trusting them to be IT pros when they don't claim to be isn't exactly trust. They don't claim to be technical or understand any of this stuff. Why they have that badge, I have no idea, but their badges are just silly stuff, like getting your picture with a badger or whatever. It's not something serious for IT pros, it's silly stuff for people on social media. Nothing wrong with it, but Spiceworks is just like Facebook, it's just a social media platform. The value is the people in the community, not the people collecting money for the ads displayed there.

                      Same as MangoLassi. You get IT advice from the people participating on the platform, never from MangoLassi or GroveSocial themselves. They are marketing people who run the social media. Now if you want to learn about social media, then MangoLassi, GroveSocial or Spiceworks are the people to talk to. But if you want IT help, you go to IT companies or professionals.

                      IT-ADMINI 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                      • DashrenderD
                        Dashrender
                        last edited by

                        @scottalanmiller
                        Assuming @IT-ADMIN's severs are installed bare metal, what backup software should he consider looking at? That's automated?

                        If someone posted a suggestion, I must have missed it.

                        scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • scottalanmillerS
                          scottalanmiller @DustinB3403
                          last edited by

                          @DustinB3403 said:

                          The badges should only be done for laughs. You gain nothing from having them. Sure you might ween some information out of their "University" that you hadn't known before. But take it with a huge grain of salt.

                          Oh, no, you would avoid their university. They don't have any IT oversight on that stuff. Unless it is classes about Spiceworks, you should not be looking at that material as it is not peer reviewed, like public posts are. So there isn't even the value that you get from free forums!

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                          • scottalanmillerS
                            scottalanmiller @Dashrender
                            last edited by

                            @Dashrender said:

                            @scottalanmiller
                            Assuming @IT-ADMIN's severs are installed bare metal, what backup software should he consider looking at? That's automated?

                            If someone posted a suggestion, I must have missed it.

                            @Reid-Cooper mentioned CrashPlan way up near the top.

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                            • Reid CooperR
                              Reid Cooper
                              last edited by

                              Yes, I was thinking that CrashPlan is free and can backup to DAS or NAS, whatever is needed. More powerful and flexible than the built in Windows backup option and since it is free, no downsides.

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
                              • Reid CooperR
                                Reid Cooper
                                last edited by

                                Probably lots of different, free backup options for a small situation like this. But without virtualization you lose most of them. I know Crashplan comes up on the communities a lot and I have used it a little. As long as you are not using their Cloud Backup option, everything is free with them. You can backup to other workstation nodes too.

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                • scottalanmillerS
                                  scottalanmiller
                                  last edited by scottalanmiller

                                  So let's start over, are these facts correct:

                                  • DAS, NAS and SAN are the same price. We need to get the right storage for the need and not talk prices or let pricing assumptions drive us to one solution or another.
                                  • A small RAID 1 unit will be large enough not only for one server but for all of the servers? Can easily get to 6TB of usable capacity. The one server is just 500GB. But you need overhead for versioning.
                                  • Windows Backup does not properly support NAS (file), so would need DAS/SAN (block.)
                                  • Other free backup options like Crashplan will properly support NAS (file) so that we can use one device for all of the servers.
                                  • Keeping the cost down is really important.
                                  • Block storage is unnecessarily exposed to ransomware.

                                  That should be the roundup of needs before arriving at a decision.

                                  scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                                  • IT-ADMINI
                                    IT-ADMIN @scottalanmiller
                                    last edited by

                                    @scottalanmiller said:

                                    Trusting them to be IT pros when they don't claim to be isn't exactly trust. They don't claim to be technical or understand any of this stuff. , you go to IT companies or professionals.

                                    no, they claim to be, because they have on their website SW academy

                                    scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • scottalanmillerS
                                      scottalanmiller @IT-ADMIN
                                      last edited by

                                      @IT-ADMIN said:

                                      no, they claim to be, because they have on their website SW academy

                                      Do you have a link to that? I've seen it before but never saw anything on it that claimed that they knew anything about IT (which they do not and really should not given that they operate a platform for discussion.)

                                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • scottalanmillerS
                                        scottalanmiller @scottalanmiller
                                        last edited by

                                        @scottalanmiller said:

                                        So let's start over, are these facts correct:

                                        • DAS, NAS and SAN are the same price. We need to get the right storage for the need and not talk prices or let pricing assumptions drive us to one solution or another.
                                        • A small RAID 1 unit will be large enough not only for one server but for all of the servers? Can easily get to 6TB of usable capacity. The one server is just 500GB. But you need overhead for versioning.
                                        • Windows Backup does not properly support NAS (file), so would need DAS/SAN (block.)
                                        • Other free backup options like Crashplan will properly support NAS (file) so that we can use one device for all of the servers.
                                        • Keeping the cost down is really important.

                                        That should be the roundup of needs before arriving at a decision.

                                        If the above is true, I think that we have a clear path to a solution:

                                        • Windows Backup is too limiting and must be abandoned.
                                        • Crashplan looks viable, needs to be tried out.
                                        • NAS is the only rational solution as it is the only one that does not require a full RAID 1 DAS unit for every server that we want to back up.
                                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • scottalanmillerS
                                          scottalanmiller
                                          last edited by

                                          The vendors that I recommend for two bay NAS (or DAS or SAN) units are always Synology, Netgear ReadyNAS and IOSafe (based on Synology.) All make two bay, RAID 1 units that are very flexible. And they all make ones that can convert between NAS and SAN. So you can use them however you like. You can use them as NAS today or make them into SAN tomorrow.

                                          And here is Brett from IOSafe in case you have any questions: @Brett-at-ioSafe

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                                          • scottalanmillerS
                                            scottalanmiller
                                            last edited by

                                            Now, of course, we get to this point and we realize that because you were so focused on DAS that we overlooked something big. The DAS units that you are talking about are very, very simple devices using USB3, eSATA or similar and do not have LUN management. That makes them a "one device per server" took.

                                            However, if you moved to SAN you can make one LUN per server that you want to back up. In this way you can still get a single SAN and backup all of your machines, you just have to have one LUN per machine and you get much less efficient use of your storage and it is much harder to use. No actual benefit over the NAS approach, but it can be done and should not be overlooked. This still completely exposes you to ransonware, though, so is not ideal there either.

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