ASUS gets their butt handed to them by the feds
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@scottalanmiller Your problem with the devices is using them outside of their target market then. If you stayed in the US, you would not be having those problems.
I know they FireTV and FireStick are also sold in the UK, Germany and Denmark. SO I would expect it to work there.
Are you attempting to access US based content outside of the US? No service provider will let you do that easily. It would seriously harm their ability to negotiate content deals.
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@JaredBusch said:
Are you attempting to access US based content outside of the US? No service provider will let you do that easily. It would seriously harm their ability to negotiate content deals.
The problem is basic, regardless of the purpose. I would like to configure my network settings like IP address, DNS servers, gateway, etc. That those settings are only partially accessible means that on some networks the device pretty much doesn't work. If DHCP is not available or can't be used, for example, it can be very difficult to change settings. And Amazon locks out the settings if you don't have security enables on the Wifi.
Think about how weird that is.... if the Wifi is wide open, you are forced to accept DHCP. You can only access the settings screen FROM the wifi security screen! It's crazy. If you are using the device someplace where you don't control the available wifi, you don't have control of your own device.
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And it is far more than network settings. Simple things like getting the box to turn on requires power cycling it by unplugging it at least 50% of the time. Not that that is complex or the end of the world, but it loses network settings a few times a day, needs power cycled a few times a day... even just "staying on" requires constant massaging. The Amazon Fire Tablets will sometimes tell you that you've not purchased the apps that Amazon sold to you and disable them. Things like that.
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So the audit wasn't all asus?
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@DustinB3403 said:
So besides the fact that ASUS is paying through the nose for this, what do the end consumers get?
Increased prices?
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@NattNatt said:
@DustinB3403 said:
So besides the fact that ASUS is paying through the nose for this, what do the end consumers get?
Increased prices?
That's a joke right? Sure we might get increased prices (well though who buy their stuff) - but I hope we get a hell of a lot more than that! Such as real security from a security device.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@JaredBusch said:
Are you attempting to access US based content outside of the US? No service provider will let you do that easily. It would seriously harm their ability to negotiate content deals.
The problem is basic, regardless of the purpose. I would like to configure my network settings like IP address, DNS servers, gateway, etc. That those settings are only partially accessible means that on some networks the device pretty much doesn't work. If DHCP is not available or can't be used, for example, it can be very difficult to change settings. And Amazon locks out the settings if you don't have security enables on the Wifi.
Think about how weird that is.... if the Wifi is wide open, you are forced to accept DHCP. You can only access the settings screen FROM the wifi security screen! It's crazy. If you are using the device someplace where you don't control the available wifi, you don't have control of your own device.
At first I was completely thinking along the lines as JB - that you were using the device outside the target market and therefor had problems relating to that.
But damn - you can't change simple IP options on a device you supposedly own? While it's true this issue came about because you're operating outside the norm - I agree that not being able to set IP to anything you want is just weird! and a pointless possible Security feature.
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@Dashrender yeah, I am outside their target, slightly, but we are trying to use the device as a normal end user. My in laws are very non-technical, they all use Chromebooks and such. They don't want to do fancy things nor do they ever leave the US. But the Fires are super complicated and problematic for them the same as us. They need both us and Amazon support to get them working. These are not devices that normal end users (from what I can do) can get working or get to do things that they expect their media devices to do.
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I just picked up one of their super cheap tablets last week to use for tracking sleep with ZIO device - I'll report any problems I run into with it.
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@Dashrender said:
I just picked up one of their super cheap tablets last week to use for tracking sleep with ZIO device - I'll report any problems I run into with it.
One of the places that the in laws ran into immediate problems was being unable to add the second adult to the device or getting kids' account to work properly.
We found that their FreeTime functionality is so dangerous that once we applied it and lost Internet access we were in a situation where we were unsure if the device was bricked. Had we not had access to a Wifi network that we had been on before, it would have had no means of authenticating us as parents.
We had to disable all FreeTime functionality across all devices, it's less than worthless. It effectively broke the devices.
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There is a additional issue with home users the average person would expect a certain level of security from a consumer device and they should do the job.
As you mentioned things like the EdgeRouter are nice and cheap but getting on set-up it not going to be easy with the UK ADSL/Fibre market. As you can't simply connect the EdgeRouter to the wall socket and away you go, your going to need a ADSL/VDSL modem between, and most ISP's don't make it easy to use them a bridge devices or like you using your own kit.e.g. I have SKY fibre at home, I plan on upgrading to UniFi AP and Edge Router later in the year, but I know the default Sky router won't go into bridge mode, and sky don't tell you the username and password to allow you to use a 3rd party router/modem. Yes I can create a separate network using the UniFi kit and just plug in the sky router into WAN port but isn't that defeating the issue of upping the security? For average home users this is beyond what they could do.
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@hobbit666 said:
There is a additional issue with home users the average person would expect a certain level of security from a consumer device and they should do the job.
As you mentioned things like the EdgeRouter are nice and cheap but getting on set-up it not going to be easy with the UK ADSL/Fibre market. As you can't simply connect the EdgeRouter to the wall socket and away you go, your going to need a ADSL/VDSL modem between, and most ISP's don't make it easy to use them a bridge devices or like you using your own kit.e.g. I have SKY fibre at home, I plan on upgrading to UniFi AP and Edge Router later in the year, but I know the default Sky router won't go into bridge mode, and sky don't tell you the username and password to allow you to use a 3rd party router/modem. Yes I can create a separate network using the UniFi kit and just plug in the sky router into WAN port but isn't that defeating the issue of upping the security? For average home users this is beyond what they could do.
I agree there. However in those same cases, the Asus and devices like them would be ruled out too as you need something specific from the ISP. Right, or am I missing something?
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@hobbit666 said:
There is a additional issue with home users the average person would expect a certain level of security from a consumer device and they should do the job.
As you mentioned things like the EdgeRouter are nice and cheap but getting on set-up it not going to be easy with the UK ADSL/Fibre market. As you can't simply connect the EdgeRouter to the wall socket and away you go, your going to need a ADSL/VDSL modem between, and most ISP's don't make it easy to use them a bridge devices or like you using your own kit.e.g. I have SKY fibre at home, I plan on upgrading to UniFi AP and Edge Router later in the year, but I know the default Sky router won't go into bridge mode, and sky don't tell you the username and password to allow you to use a 3rd party router/modem. Yes I can create a separate network using the UniFi kit and just plug in the sky router into WAN port but isn't that defeating the issue of upping the security? For average home users this is beyond what they could do.
I don't understand where your issue is. Is the ISP provided device a NAT firewall? in other words, they don't just provide you an IP that is on the net?
In the US, I have a cable modem or a DSL modem - they both provide me with a real IP that's directly on the internet.
That said, I know there are a few providers (Windstream) those devices don't provide a real IP, the ISP controlled device does local home NATing - in which case to get them out of the middle, you can use bridge mode to hopefully get a real IP to your own firewall - but I guess the question is - is that really necessary? I suppose if the ISP doesn't have their device completely open to the internet, if they are doing any type of filtering at all - that could cause problems.
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@coliver said:
You can get an ER-X for 60$ (Not sure if that is what others here would recommend) you can also get a UAP-AC for $100. Not bad for the start of an enterprise network.
If you have an account on the Ubiquiti site, you can buy them for $49 from Ubiquiti.
I just looked, you can also buy the AC-LITE for &89.00
Edit: If you're in the US.
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@johnhooks said:
@coliver said:
You can get an ER-X for 60$ (Not sure if that is what others here would recommend) you can also get a UAP-AC for $100. Not bad for the start of an enterprise network.
If you have an account on the Ubiquiti site, you can buy them for $49 from Ubiquiti.
I just looked, you can also buy the AC-LITE for &89.00
Edit: If you're in the US.
Oooh... That's tempting, I may pick one of those up. I need something to replace my aging Linksys/DD-WRT router.
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@Dashrender said:
I don't understand where your issue is. Is the ISP provided device a NAT firewall? in other words, they don't just provide you an IP that is on the net?
What i'm saying is in the UK 90% of ISPs will give a dynamic IP. Also unless I can connect the EdgeRouter (or better Router) to the "internet" with a real IP and not set it up double NAT'n so to speak I don't see the point. Now with SKY for example they consider the Routers as managed devices so you can't use your own kit.
So for the average home user being able to use a 3rd party router would be pointless or over their technical ability to configure the network.
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@johnhooks said:
@coliver said:
You can get an ER-X for 60$ (Not sure if that is what others here would recommend) you can also get a UAP-AC for $100. Not bad for the start of an enterprise network.
If you have an account on the Ubiquiti site, you can buy them for $49 from Ubiquiti.
I just looked, you can also buy the AC-LITE for &89.00
Edit: If you're in the US.
Think I know where some of my bonus is going
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@hobbit666 said:
@Dashrender said:
I don't understand where your issue is. Is the ISP provided device a NAT firewall? in other words, they don't just provide you an IP that is on the net?
What i'm saying is in the UK 90% of ISPs will give a dynamic IP. Also unless I can connect the EdgeRouter (or better Router) to the "internet" with a real IP and not set it up double NAT'n so to speak I don't see the point. Now with SKY for example they consider the Routers as managed devices so you can't use your own kit.
So for the average home user being able to use a 3rd party router would be pointless or over their technical ability to configure the network.
Yup, just got PlusNets "new" supposed top class router...its horrible, cant assign IP's to MAC's, can't setup multiple SSID's or change anything I want to...all I have is change SSID name, decide whether its dual band (2.4 and 5GHz) or to split them, change the DHCP pool range and...thats about it...
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@hobbit666 said:
@Dashrender said:
I don't understand where your issue is. Is the ISP provided device a NAT firewall? in other words, they don't just provide you an IP that is on the net?
What i'm saying is in the UK 90% of ISPs will give a dynamic IP. Also unless I can connect the EdgeRouter (or better Router) to the "internet" with a real IP and not set it up double NAT'n so to speak I don't see the point. Now with SKY for example they consider the Routers as managed devices so you can't use your own kit.
So for the average home user being able to use a 3rd party router would be pointless or over their technical ability to configure the network.
I'd guess that 90%+ in the US also give a dynamic IP, that doesn't preclude you from using a ERX or any normal firewall. Grant that DHCP provided IP is a real internet IP, not an internal only IP, like 10.1.2.x.
Unless double NAT causes you a specific problem - what's wrong with it? The point of double NATing would be to protect you from the ISP. As you said, the ISP maintains control over their device. By double NATing, the only thing the ISP can see it the router/firewall appliance you connect to their device. This protects you from them. By them having control of that router, they have ethernet level access to your network, which allows them to do all kinds of bad things.
As for configuring the router from an end user point of view - why is this any harder than what we have in the US?
You plug the device(D1) into the ISP provided device, D1 gets a DHCP provided address from the ISP device (doesn't matter than it's an internal IP), then all of your computers behind D1 are protected.
As far as your ISP is concerned, you only have one computer at home accessing the internet.
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@NattNatt said:
Yup, just got PlusNets "new" supposed top class router...its horrible, cant assign IP's to MAC's, can't setup multiple SSID's or change anything I want to...all I have is change SSID name, decide whether its dual band (2.4 and 5GHz) or to split them, change the DHCP pool range and...thats about it...
Using their device is like letting the fox in the henhouse - I'd disable as much functionality as possible, install my own ERX behind theirs.. and my own AP behind the ERX.
Now you can have whatever you want settings wise, config, etc.
