Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates
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@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@itivan80 said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
I never ever liked windows update service. In one hand they fix some issues but in the other hand they create more unnecessary issues. I am glad you were able to isolate the update and made it work congrats.
I agree that MS should do better at making updates, but all things considered - with millions if not billions of combinations and different setups - they could definitely have way more issues.
But Jason - Linux Distros have billions upon Billions of deployments and they don't have these issues... or so we're told.
Exactly. Why are Linux distros, BSD distros, and MacOS distros all able to do this with very, very few issues, but MS constantly having issues with it?
Also, the issues that people have are really never about different combinations with Windows. It's Windows itself breaking, things that have little to nothing to do (in most cases) with configuration or third party components.
Also, other OSes update a lot more than Windows does.
This is a great question - of course one of which I do not have an answer. Though I guess it's likely to do with fundamental design differences - does nix use DLLs? There's no registry on nix either (at least not in general) - this poor design choices by MS could be all the reason for the problems.
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@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@itivan80 said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
I never ever liked windows update service. In one hand they fix some issues but in the other hand they create more unnecessary issues. I am glad you were able to isolate the update and made it work congrats.
I agree that MS should do better at making updates, but all things considered - with millions if not billions of combinations and different setups - they could definitely have way more issues.
But Jason - Linux Distros have billions upon Billions of deployments and they don't have these issues... or so we're told.
Exactly. Why are Linux distros, BSD distros, and MacOS distros all able to do this with very, very few issues, but MS constantly having issues with it?
Also, the issues that people have are really never about different combinations with Windows. It's Windows itself breaking, things that have little to nothing to do (in most cases) with configuration or third party components.
Also, other OSes update a lot more than Windows does.
This is a great question - of course one of which I do not have an answer. Though I guess it's likely to do with fundamental design differences - does nix use DLLs? There's no registry on nix either (at least not in general) - this poor design choices by MS could be all the reason for the problems.
Could be, but are also things that they can fix. But Linux uses config files like a registry. And Linux has shared libraries. And once in a while they have issues, but fixes are normally easy. But how many of these Windows update issues are related to DLL and registry issues since 2003? Not many, I don't think.
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@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@itivan80 said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
I never ever liked windows update service. In one hand they fix some issues but in the other hand they create more unnecessary issues. I am glad you were able to isolate the update and made it work congrats.
I agree that MS should do better at making updates, but all things considered - with millions if not billions of combinations and different setups - they could definitely have way more issues.
But Jason - Linux Distros have billions upon Billions of deployments and they don't have these issues... or so we're told.
Exactly. Why are Linux distros, BSD distros, and MacOS distros all able to do this with very, very few issues, but MS constantly having issues with it?
Also, the issues that people have are really never about different combinations with Windows. It's Windows itself breaking, things that have little to nothing to do (in most cases) with configuration or third party components.
Also, other OSes update a lot more than Windows does.
This is a great question - of course one of which I do not have an answer. Though I guess it's likely to do with fundamental design differences - does nix use DLLs? There's no registry on nix either (at least not in general) - this poor design choices by MS could be all the reason for the problems.
Could be, but are also things that they can fix. But Linux uses config files like a registry. And Linux has shared libraries. And once in a while they have issues, but fixes are normally easy. But how many of these Windows update issues are related to DLL and registry issues since 2003? Not many, I don't think.
I would suspect more than you might realize - but what do I really know - I never dig in that much to find out.
I'm guessing the shared libraries are often at the root of the problem. a few years ago - plugging in a Kindle would BSOD a machine after an update - I assume that was shared library that changed and caused huge issues.
The lack of support for those types of items in nix likely mean there are less issues there.
Of course though - this thread is about Windows Server, not desktop - where this should be MUCH less of an issue with properly designed code. -
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
a few years ago - plugging in a Kindle would BSOD a machine after an update - I assume that was shared library that changed and caused huge issues.
That feels like a pretty weird thing to assume. Why would you assume that it had a conflicting shared library rather than a bug?
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@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
The lack of support for those types of items in nix likely mean there are less issues there.
Confused. You mean because Linux supports more hardware, not less, and does the support themselves, instead of making third parties do it, that there are fewer issues?
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@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
a few years ago - plugging in a Kindle would BSOD a machine after an update - I assume that was shared library that changed and caused huge issues.
That feels like a pretty weird thing to assume. Why would you assume that it had a conflicting shared library rather than a bug?
I guess that's 'where' the bug is. I suppose it's entirely possible that the shitty kindle software hit a but in a shitty update.
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@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
Of course though - this thread is about Windows Server, not desktop - where this should be MUCH less of an issue with properly designed code.
Same code, they don't make it twice. Less hardware hotplugging, but probably just as many lines of code in use.
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@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
Of course though - this thread is about Windows Server, not desktop - where this should be MUCH less of an issue with properly designed code.
Same code, they don't make it twice. Less hardware hotplugging, but probably just as many lines of code in use.
Less desktop apps on the platform, but you're right - the base code is the same.
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@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
a few years ago - plugging in a Kindle would BSOD a machine after an update - I assume that was shared library that changed and caused huge issues.
That feels like a pretty weird thing to assume. Why would you assume that it had a conflicting shared library rather than a bug?
I guess that's 'where' the bug is. I suppose it's entirely possible that the shitty kindle software hit a but in a shitty update.
If there is a bug in a DLL, then it's always there and that it is a DLL isn't a factor. That the Kindle is using someone else's DLL and depending on one instead of providing their own code makes it their responsibility to ensure that the DLL they use works to some degree. There's nothing in Windows that makes a product need to use a DLL. DLLs are not intrinsic to Windows, it's just their standard mechanism for when you want to do that.
But WHY would you assume a DLL in this case? Nothing you've said would point to a DLL. What is making you think that a DLL would be an issue in a case like that? And specifically an issue with DLL versioning. That doesn't seem obvious or even likely. I can't figure out what would make DLLs even a primary suspect?
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@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@scottalanmiller said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
@dashrender said in Server 2012 R2 not installing Updates:
Of course though - this thread is about Windows Server, not desktop - where this should be MUCH less of an issue with properly designed code.
Same code, they don't make it twice. Less hardware hotplugging, but probably just as many lines of code in use.
Less desktop apps on the platform, but you're right - the base code is the same.
Fewer desktop apps, maybe. But in the Windows world, server often is treated as a desktop (like 90% of the time) so the reduction is rarely what you'd hope. And there tends to be lots of server-only code too, often running as desktop apps.
