@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

You could easily be adding an additional 2-6 K on top of what you estimated for just the chassis and drives.

Makes sense, ill keep looking. This we could make a saving my getting smaller drives, say 8TB, but more of them?

Maybe, but a lot more of them. What capacity do you actually need?

170 TB, usable. But with ability to expand in the future if we need to.

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

SC847E16-R1K28LPB

CPU, RAM, Power supplies, motherboard?

I assumed that is already within the device?

Chassis implies none of those things. If you look, the chassis lists the kinds of motherboards it supports. It doesn't have a mobo, let alone CPU, RAM, etc.

https://www.supermicro.com/products/chassis/4U/847/SC847E16-R1K28LPB

SuperMicro you always buy through a dealer. Looking at SM's website is just about useless. Talk to PCM UK and have them assemble something for you, trying to do it yourself will be a nightmare and that's never how SM expects it to work.

Would that PCM work also include OS setup/setting up the file system? So we just rack it in the office and turn it on...

It's very plausible you could have the dealer do this for you, but I'd reload it myself.

What sort of hardware support do we get? I assume just manufacturer warranty?

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

You could easily be adding an additional 2-6 K on top of what you estimated for just the chassis and drives.

Makes sense, ill keep looking. This we could make a saving my getting smaller drives, say 8TB, but more of them?

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

SC847E16-R1K28LPB

CPU, RAM, Power supplies, motherboard?

I assumed that is already within the device?

Chassis implies none of those things. If you look, the chassis lists the kinds of motherboards it supports. It doesn't have a mobo, let alone CPU, RAM, etc.

https://www.supermicro.com/products/chassis/4U/847/SC847E16-R1K28LPB

SuperMicro you always buy through a dealer. Looking at SM's website is just about useless. Talk to PCM UK and have them assemble something for you, trying to do it yourself will be a nightmare and that's never how SM expects it to work.

Would that PCM work also include OS setup/setting up the file system? So we just rack it in the office and turn it on...

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

SC847E16-R1K28LPB

CPU, RAM, Power supplies, motherboard?

I assumed that is already within the device?

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

Drives alone for this are going to cost you (assuming amazon prices - not VAT) $6,325.

Just had a look now:

24 * DC HC530 inc VAT = £12,503.53
1 x SC847E16-R1K28LPB inc VAT = £1,655.99

Total: £14,159.52

Just need to configure it in house.

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

SC847E16-R1K28LPB

Yes, that's definitely an option.

Ok, i'll look in to that.

Something like: SC847E16-R1K28LPB on SuperMicro?

Yep, i forgot the ',' lol

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

Not sure if this matters, but the target will be used by Windows Servers... would that make a difference here?

No, Windows just isn't up to the job. That the backups will talk over SMB is not really a factor, Synology is Linux, too. All enterprise storage options are Linux based (or BSD based) and use Samba as their interface layer. So it's really the only possibility.

Thats fine. I meant for the clients backing up to this target. They are Windows.

I'll take a look at SuperMicro and Huawei drives, and see what PCM say if I cant figure it out.

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

And obviously you need to run Linux on this. Fedora, Ubuntu, CentOS, Debian, Suse. You need MD RAID for protection, and a really good filesystem that can handle the size, XFS most likely.

ZFS and BtrFS will work, too.

Not sure if this matters, but the target will be used by Windows Servers... would that make a difference here?

Anything like Synology NAS suitable here? Could look at 16 bay unit and one of their expansions...

Something like this for drive? https://www.ebuyer.com/858387-seagate-ironwolf-14tb-nas-hard-drive-3-5-sata-iii-6gb-s-7200rpm-256mb-st14000vn0008?mkwid=s_dc&pcrid=51482414339&pkw=&pmt=&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI_fzYgvfm4QIVSFXTCh2fVQ0WEAQYASABEgI8ZPD_BwE

I'm based in the UK. My budget for this is around £12,000 - £15,000 with VAT. (That includes HDDs, NAS/Server/VAT/Delivery).

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

The issue is due to the capacity you're looking at, unless you were going with those 18TB SSD Samsung drives, which at that capacity you'd consider RAID6.

It's 7.2k disks, only for backups.

In something like RAID 6, imagine the time it would take to resilver even a single drive. That make drives, that slow, at that size... it could take 2-3 months easily to replace a single failed drive!

Yeah, that is why I am checking before going ahead with anything thanks Scott.

Any particular vendor/hardware you would suggest? The 24 x array with 14TB drives is just in theory in my head at the moment, so - what tech would you suggest. Business is against using cloud here for this.

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

These are 1^15 drives, would that be fine raid 10?

URE rates are not applicable in RAID 0 or RAID 1, and therefore not in anything based on them. URE is a risk for parity RAID.

Ok, makes sense. Would I want to configure as one large 24 drive array, or say, 2 x 12 disk arrays in the one box?

The same rule applies here, One Big Raid.

Splitting here doesn't make sense, and at scale you'd use RAIN. Since this is all one box, use one big raid.

Ok cool, thanks.

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

The issue is due to the capacity you're looking at, unless you were going with those 18TB SSD Samsung drives, which at that capacity you'd consider RAID6.

It's 7.2k disks, only for backups.

The disks are really slow compared to an SSD, so if you lost 1 disk your repair time for any parity array would take weeks if not longer.

Even with RAID10 it's going to be painfully slow.

Thats fine, as its backup area. Raid 10 looks to be the choice here. If a disk fails, the new disk will rebuild from its mirror/partner, so no calcs needed right?

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid limits?:

These are 1^15 drives, would that be fine raid 10?

URE rates are not applicable in RAID 0 or RAID 1, and therefore not in anything based on them. URE is a risk for parity RAID.

Ok, makes sense. Would I want to configure as one large 24 drive array, or say, 2 x 12 disk arrays in the one box?

@DustinB3403 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

The issue is due to the capacity you're looking at, unless you were going with those 18TB SSD Samsung drives, which at that capacity you'd consider RAID6.

It's 7.2k disks, only for backups.

@scottalanmiller said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

@Jimmy9008 said in Raid10, must use or another Raid/limits?:

Hi folks,

Im looking at an array of 24 x 14TB drives in Raid 10, any reason to avoid that? It meets my capacity needs, but not sure where the limit of Raid 6 and the line to use Raid 10 sits?

Best,
Jim

No RAID 6 system will be safe with drives of that size. Resilver time alone would make it a non-starter. RAID 10 is the ony viable choice there, even with 15K SAS drives.

These are 1^15 drives, would that be fine raid 10?

@travisdh1 Any other options other than 10?