Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video
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Worth noting that this was recording some time ago. Now Microsoft's new development platform, Visual Studio Code, has C# and F# support, but support for VB.NET has been dropped in it. This is the first time that MS has actively started to remove VB support from part of its ecosystem. Traditionally it was just kept on the back burner or given as an "extra" example. But now, for the first time, it is actually being left out.
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- Now as Windows grew up they needed more and more power from basic to do the things that they needed to do to compete with new languages and new paradigms that are coming out on other platforms eventually BASIC gave way to Visual Basic which was still BASIC just with a lot more stuff added to it.
Stanforth BASIC is a version of FORTRAN II, the difference being that it uses an interpreter and it is stored in a serial file, as opposed to on cards. That enabled it to be used on smaller systems with a magnetic tape drive rather than an expensive card reader.
BASIC had the same pupose as Fortran, for use by scientists and engineers to create small routines to solve mathematical problems and sort lists.
VB is nothing like BASIC at all. It is an object orientated language derived from Lisp, a string handling language used for expert systems. The only reason its called BASIC is for marketing purposes.
COBOl is not really a language at all but a script. It was used by very large businesses to do very simple things with a very high degree of repitition - for instance, calculating and printing bills for customers of a gas supply authority.
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@Jared999 said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
BASIC had the same pupose as Fortran, for use by scientists and engineers to create small routines to solve mathematical problems and sort lists.
That's not accurate. BASIC was made for learning programming, hence the name (Beginner's All Purpose Symbolic Instruction Code). It was both for beginnings, and to be all purpose unlike COBOL and Fortran that were for specific uses.
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@Jared999 said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
COBOl is not really a language at all but a script. It was used by very large businesses to do very simple things with a very high degree of repitition - for instance, calculating and printing bills for customers of a gas supply authority.
It's very much a language. In every sense. And a compiled one, so not a script at all.
It was designed for use by financial departments and is still used on Wall St.
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@Jared999 said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
Stanforth BASIC is a version of FORTRAN II, the difference being that it uses an interpreter and it is stored in a serial file, as opposed to on cards. That enabled it to be used on smaller systems with a magnetic tape drive rather than an expensive card reader.
Whatever that is, you can't even Google it, literally zero results.
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@Jared999 said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
VB is nothing like BASIC at all. It is an object orientated language derived from Lisp, a string handling language used for expert systems. The only reason its called BASIC is for marketing purposes.
No, it's actually BASIC. If you come from BASIC, and try Visual Basic, it's absolutely the same language. If you try Lisp, it takes two seconds to realize it's not even related.
Your information isn't just wrong, it's bizarrely wrong. Lisp is a functional language and cannot be made object oriented. And it can't be written like an imperative language. They are wholly different things. Imperative languages, like BASIC, COBOL, and Fortran, can be made object oriented because it's just a layer. That VB is OO implies that it is from BASIC and can't be from Lisp, rather than the opposite. VB is not actually OO, though, it simply allows OO, there is a difference. But VB isn't a string handling language, nor functional, nor useful for expert systems.
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I started with basic when I was 10 I remember, so that was like 1984. I found it interesting but it never inspired me. Then i discovered c which was worlds different and just beautiful. I did that a long time and eventually started doing c++ along with it which to me was even more polished than c. Just my personal experience is all and I know it will be different for everyone. I dabbled in Fortran and liked it but never learned it. I don't know why, was probably too busy chasing girls:(
I also dabbled in vb but hated it. To me, it just made no sense and everything was harder to accomplish anything. So, to me my opinion is a little different than yours on this, I still think plain vb was horrible and should be scrubbed from the face of the earth. I went back to the c family and never looked back.
I should really see if there is a more modern implementation of Fortran, I thought ti was cool when I was a teenager lol.
Cobol is about the same degree of terrible as vb.
Just my opinions from personal experiences so not an attack on anyone else's experiences because they could be much different than mine.
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@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I started with basic when I was 10 I remember, so that was like 1984. I found it interesting but it never inspired me. Then i discovered c which was worlds different and just beautiful. I did that a long time and eventually started doing c++ along with it which to me was even more polished than c. Just my personal experience is all and I know it will be different for everyone. I dabbled in Fortran and liked it but never learned it.
Not too dissimilar. Started in BASIC on DOS in 1984/5 when I was ~9. Did C a little later, then dabbled in Lisp but never really got it. Then got into Fortran and learned it more than BASIC and ended up teaching it, lol.
Taught C as well, but Fortran probably four times as much teaching work.
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@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I also dabbled in vb but hated it. To me, it just made no sense and everything was harder to accomplish anything. So, to me my opinion is a little different than yours on this, I still think plain vb was horrible and should be scrubbed from the face of the earth. I went back to the c family and never looked back.
Everything that was bad about BASIC, but worse with no excuse for it, lol.
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@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I should really see if there is a more modern implementation of Fortran, I thought ti was cool when I was a teenager lol.
Sure is, fully modern Fortran on Linux with the GCC compiler toolkit. Still used, insanely fast. Compiles through the same pipeline as some of the best C code.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I started with basic when I was 10 I remember, so that was like 1984. I found it interesting but it never inspired me. Then i discovered c which was worlds different and just beautiful. I did that a long time and eventually started doing c++ along with it which to me was even more polished than c. Just my personal experience is all and I know it will be different for everyone. I dabbled in Fortran and liked it but never learned it.
Not too dissimilar. Started in BASIC on DOS in 1984/5 when I was ~9. Did C a little later, then dabbled in Lisp but never really got it. Then got into Fortran and learned it more than BASIC and ended up teaching it, lol.
Taught C as well, but Fortran probably four times as much teaching work.
I heard good things about Lisp but never investigated at all.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I also dabbled in vb but hated it. To me, it just made no sense and everything was harder to accomplish anything. So, to me my opinion is a little different than yours on this, I still think plain vb was horrible and should be scrubbed from the face of the earth. I went back to the c family and never looked back.
Everything that was bad about BASIC, but worse with no excuse for it, lol.
Yeah that's pretty much my opinion too. I guess it made more sense to others but not me.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I should really see if there is a more modern implementation of Fortran, I thought ti was cool when I was a teenager lol.
Sure is, fully modern Fortran on Linux with the GCC compiler toolkit. Still used, insanely fast. Compiles through the same pipeline as some of the best C code.
Ok yeah I'm looking into this today!
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@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I also dabbled in vb but hated it. To me, it just made no sense and everything was harder to accomplish anything. So, to me my opinion is a little different than yours on this, I still think plain vb was horrible and should be scrubbed from the face of the earth. I went back to the c family and never looked back.
Everything that was bad about BASIC, but worse with no excuse for it, lol.
Yeah that's pretty much my opinion too. I guess it made more sense to others but not me.
There were lots of people addicted to "I know one thing" and were scared to learn something new and it made them feel better about it.
Also made their resumes look better.
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@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I should really see if there is a more modern implementation of Fortran, I thought ti was cool when I was a teenager lol.
Sure is, fully modern Fortran on Linux with the GCC compiler toolkit. Still used, insanely fast. Compiles through the same pipeline as some of the best C code.
Ok yeah I'm looking into this today!
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Compiles modern Fortran 2008 code!
It's pretty much the world's "go to" Fortran compiler today.
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Actually, it's now supporting Fortran 2018!
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@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I also dabbled in vb but hated it. To me, it just made no sense and everything was harder to accomplish anything. So, to me my opinion is a little different than yours on this, I still think plain vb was horrible and should be scrubbed from the face of the earth. I went back to the c family and never looked back.
Everything that was bad about BASIC, but worse with no excuse for it, lol.
Yeah that's pretty much my opinion too. I guess it made more sense to others but not me.
There were lots of people addicted to "I know one thing" and were scared to learn something new and it made them feel better about it.
Also made their resumes look better.
Yeah see that never really bothered me. The coursework i did in school cures you of that really quick. Every mechanics, electrostatic, or solid state problem is words different and there is no comfortable zone lol. So learning new things has never been a problem for me.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@scottalanmiller said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
@jmoore said in Why Visual Basic Is the Worst Programming Language for Your Project SAMIT Video:
I should really see if there is a more modern implementation of Fortran, I thought ti was cool when I was a teenager lol.
Sure is, fully modern Fortran on Linux with the GCC compiler toolkit. Still used, insanely fast. Compiles through the same pipeline as some of the best C code.
Ok yeah I'm looking into this today!
Awesome thanks!
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First BASIC on the PC was gwbasic. It was a typical BASIC dialect. Just like you'd see on micro computers of the 80's like VIC 20, ZX81 etc. BASIC as a language was actually made for educational use. Easier to learn and not as many quirks as other languages of the same era.
Anyway, you couldn't really do any serious applications with gwbasic. It was followed by qbasic a little later. And then Visual Basic. And then Visual Basic .NET which was very different. The reason Microsoft put a lot of effort on BASIC was because Bill Gates loved the language and thought it was great.
