NextCloud and PHP 7


  • Service Provider

    NextCloud officially recommends RHEL/CentOS 7 + PHP 7 as one of the main recommended methods of installing NextCloud.

    Yet as we are all well aware, CentOS 7 ships with PHP 5.4.

    We went down this rabbit hole a year ago with @jospoortvliet and others from ownCloud at the time.

    So last night, I posted on NextCloud's own forum, and was told by @jospoortvliet this morning that it is not supported.

    This is a serious damned WTF moment here. I mean I know @jospoortvliet is not a technical lead. We learned that a year ago.

    But FFS if you are going to say a method is the recommended, then dangit, tell us how you want it done. Don't tell me to become a f****[moderated] customer.


  • Service Provider

    I've been building on Fedora 25 because of this issue.


  • Service Provider

    That the recommended method isn't supported is a foundational problem - it indicates that no supported or recommended at least option exists.


  • Service Provider


  • Service Provider

    And the supported platform list specifically states PHP5.6 + required. So that is not any different because it is not part of RHEL/CentOS.

    0_1488989245108_upload-db812917-e91f-4b1f-a43f-c285841cb885


  • Service Provider

    That's why I decided to just make the leap. Once I was not going with 5.4 it just didn't feel like any of it made sense.

    It works beautifully on F25.


  • Service Provider

    @scottalanmiller I will not continue to support and recommend a company that cannot be bothered to do anything except tell me to become a customer when they purport to be such a FOSS supporting company. This is really f[moderated] basic.

    Provide the method required to be considered a valid install path for the recommended system configuration.

    Why would I ever want to trust them for anything when they say one thing and act another way.


  • Service Provider

    @scottalanmiller said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    That's why I decided to just make the leap. Once I was not going with 5.4 it just didn't feel like any of it made sense.

    It works beautifully on F25.

    That is not even on their supported list BTW. I mean I know what Fedora is, but it is specifically not listed.


  • Service Provider

    I don't think that there is an end to end supported option. Either the OS or the PHP is going to be outside of support. No way to get every vendor to consider it supported for their portion.



  • @JaredBusch said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @scottalanmiller said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    That's why I decided to just make the leap. Once I was not going with 5.4 it just didn't feel like any of it made sense.

    It works beautifully on F25.

    That is not even on their supported list BTW. I mean I know what Fedora is, but it is specifically not listed.

    Yeah that's frustrating. I actually opted to stay with Nextcloud 10 this time around because when I attempted to upgrade to PHP 7 and install Nextcloud 11 with my test server I ran into a lot of problems.


  • Service Provider

    Almost exactly one year ago btw on the first shit storm on this..

    https://mangolassi.it/topic/8433/adding-remi-s-rpm-repository-to-centos-7-and-updating-to-php-5-6


  • Service Provider

    @wirestyle22 said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @JaredBusch said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @scottalanmiller said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    That's why I decided to just make the leap. Once I was not going with 5.4 it just didn't feel like any of it made sense.

    It works beautifully on F25.

    That is not even on their supported list BTW. I mean I know what Fedora is, but it is specifically not listed.

    Yeah that's frustrating. I actually opted to stay with Nextcloud 10 this time around because when I attempted to upgrade to PHP 7 and install Nextcloud 11 with my test server I ran into a lot of problems.

    I am looking to perform a new install.



  • @JaredBusch said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @wirestyle22 said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @JaredBusch said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @scottalanmiller said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    That's why I decided to just make the leap. Once I was not going with 5.4 it just didn't feel like any of it made sense.

    It works beautifully on F25.

    That is not even on their supported list BTW. I mean I know what Fedora is, but it is specifically not listed.

    Yeah that's frustrating. I actually opted to stay with Nextcloud 10 this time around because when I attempted to upgrade to PHP 7 and install Nextcloud 11 with my test server I ran into a lot of problems.

    I am looking to perform a new install.

    Right--that's what I was doing, but I still needed to upgrade to PHP 7 to get Nextcloud 11 working and never could



  • Is NextClouds business model to offer support for people who install this themselves?


  • Service Provider

    NethServer 7 has NextCloud built in. Maybe they are the official install ;)


  • Service Provider

    And @jospoortvliet still seems as clueless as last year. I get he is marketing and not technical. But FFS, just get a technical lead to post an officially recommended repo for acquiring PHP 5.6+



  • @JaredBusch I know you favor CentOS, and I do too, but what about Ubuntu 16.04?



  • For those CentOS 7 users. You can use IUS repo. When installing SnipeIT with their script, it use EPEL (required) and IUS.

    yum install php71u



  • @black3dynamite Thanks for that :)


  • Service Provider

    @black3dynamite said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    For those CentOS 7 users. You can use IUS repo. When installing SnipeIT with their script, it use EPEL (required) and IUS.

    yum install php71u

    Yeah, someone from the ownCloud team had finally posted a recommendation last year, for a source and I believe they used IUS.

    I had already went forward with using Remi by that point though.

    Again, right now, I want the official recommendation from NextCloud.

    SHould be dead simple, but it is apparently not.



  • I understand the perspective of both sides on this. I see Jared's frustrations and I see the NC team's frustrations.

    From Jared's side of it, I do believe you are owed an answer.

    I can also see the frustration from the NC team. They make a really nice, capable product and probably 98% of users are using it for free. They need to sell support to keep their doors open.



  • @IRJ paid support for a basic install though?



  • @IRJ said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    I understand the perspective of both sides on this. I see Jared's frustrations and I see the NC team's frustrations.

    From Jared's side of it, I do believe you are owed an answer.

    I can also see the frustration from the NC team. They make a really nice, capable product and probably 98% of users are using it for free. They need to sell support to keep their doors open.

    But at the same time their recommendations and such need to be accurate.


  • Service Provider

    @IRJ said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    I understand the perspective of both sides on this. I see Jared's frustrations and I see the NC team's frustrations.

    From Jared's side of it, I do believe you are owed an answer.

    I can also see the frustration from the NC team. They make a really nice, capable product and probably 98% of users are using it for free. They need to sell support to keep their doors open.

    As someone who only sells his time, I very much understand that. But they need to provide a working installation method for the listed operating systems or remove them. If CentOS 7 was not listed, I would either do it myself on CentOS 7 and accept that risk, or I would switch to a different operating system.

    As many of you know I prefer CentOS, but I have nothing against running something else when it is the only supported method. Hence, I run Ubuntu for my UniFi controller.


  • Service Provider

    @IRJ said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    I can also see the frustration from the NC team. They make a really nice, capable product and probably 98% of users are using it for free. They need to sell support to keep their doors open.

    I think having a fully enterprise ready, recommended install path is really important, though. I get both sides and at a high level, it makes sense. What I would be happy with is a change of recommendations, for example. Make Fedora or Tumbleweed the recommended way to go.

    The issue that I have, which is a little different than Jared's but not much, is that even if I pay for NextCloud support, I'm still left on an unsupported platform. CentOS 7 doesn't have a supported PHP 7 option. There is a moderately good option in IUS, but it is not considered a really enterprise approach. So I'm caught in that middle ground. There is no vendor willing to cover the whole installation and no one stands behind the final product. There is a gap in the stack, and a pretty big one. But one that would not be that hard to fix and has been an issue that is well known for a long time.


  • Service Provider

    I just happened to write this four weeks ago, but really applies here.

    https://mangolassi.it/topic/12477/supported-mismatch-can-you-call-that-supported


  • Service Provider

    @scottalanmiller said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    @IRJ said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    I can also see the frustration from the NC team. They make a really nice, capable product and probably 98% of users are using it for free. They need to sell support to keep their doors open.

    I think having a fully enterprise ready, recommended install path is really important, though. I get both sides and at a high level, it makes sense. What I would be happy with is a change of recommendations, for example. Make Fedora or Tumbleweed the recommended way to go.

    The issue that I have, which is a little different than Jared's but not much, is that even if I pay for NextCloud support, I'm still left on an unsupported platform. CentOS 7 doesn't have a supported PHP 7 option. There is a moderately good option in IUS, but it is not considered a really enterprise approach. So I'm caught in that middle ground. There is no vendor willing to cover the whole installation and no one stands behind the final product. There is a gap in the stack, and a pretty big one. But one that would not be that hard to fix and has been an issue that is well known for a long time.

    And to clarify, I am looking for exactly that type of information. We all know that PHP 5.6+ is not available on CentOS 7. We all know there are many ways to get it.

    All they have to do is either remove CentOS as an option or say we support X method of PHP 5.6+ installation.

    Personally I prefer the Remi approach because adding his repository adds only PHP related items for the most part. That is the only reason the repository exists. Remi also works with upstream, so often what is in his repo gets added eventually to core or extras.

    Others like IUS approach because it keeps things separate.


  • Service Provider

    And NextCloud finally responded. It seems their attitude towards their community is actually not any different than it was when they were ownCloud.

    When they were ownCloud, it was repeated continually on their forums that there was no support or or any point in using their forums. If you wanted a answer you had to open a bug report on the tracker.

    NextCloud has now said, through @jospoortvliet that if you want any kind of answer from NextCloud, that you have to be a paying customer and that their forums are not worth using.

    https://help.nextcloud.com/t/what-is-the-supported-php7-installation-method-for-centos-7/9832/17



  • NextCloud is a really good product. I wouldn't let this incident effect how good their product is for FREE.

    Bottom line is that if they don't sell their support, the product will no longer be supported at all.


  • Service Provider

    @IRJ said in NextCloud and PHP 7:

    NextCloud is a really good product. I wouldn't let this incident effect how good their product is fore FREE.

    Bottom line is that if they don't sell their support, the product will no longer be supported at all.

    I think that that, too, is part of Jared's concern and having a good officially supported end to end deployment proposal encourages people to buy support.


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