How to Balance Standards - Work and Personal
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@Breffni-Potter said:
He knows you are moving on right?
I think he is just trying to poke at you, shrug him off.
Well, I made a post on Facebook about it and tagged him in it and he has since unfriended me.
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@handsofqwerty said:
Now, I know the company pays my paycheck, but I still handle the other functions of my job. Part of why where I work has a booming tech business is because of the fact I hold things to a higher standard, and customers realize that and refer others and also keep coming back. So what I do works and works well.
This is a problem here. The company is your customer, not the customers. Your job is to make the company happy. That the company may or may not make more or less money because you hold things to a higher standard is a red herring and has nothing to do with the equation. What you do works well by an artificial standard to you. Unless the company has officially said this to you and clearly agrees with this being the case (we can assume that because this question has come up that they do not) then it is something you have decided and must be treated as either untrue or irrelevant. It has no purpose being stated.
A higher standard would be "what benefits your customer most" and since your customer is the business and since you don't have all of the potential information about their needs, costs, etc. you are in no position to make a determination as to whether doing what they don't want you to do actually helps them or not, correct?
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@handsofqwerty said:
- advocate for the customer when they are too stupid/ignorant to do it for themselves
In your case, though, the customer "to you" is the shop, not the shop's customers. It is absolutely critical that you remember who is the final consumer of your work. The "customer" that you are thinking of is not your customer but the company's customer.
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Not the best way to handle it perhaps.
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@handsofqwerty said:
- get them the best solution at the best price while still making my company the most money
That's not for you to decide. Is this explicitly stated by the company that you work for? If not, you may be making this up. It sounds good, but there is nothing to imply that this is your responsibility if not stated.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
- get them the best solution at the best price while still making my company the most money
That's not for you to decide. Is this explicitly stated by the company that you work for? If not, you may be making this up. It sounds good, but there is nothing to imply that this is your responsibility if not stated.
My job is to make the customer happy and the company money. My sales accomplish both.
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@handsofqwerty said:
- don't lie or BS the customer EVER, and if you lose the sale because they don't like someone telling them the truth, so be it
Again, sounds good, but this is rarely how stores with salespeople operate. Are you sure that this is company policy for you? I'm not saying that you should be unethical, but there is a lot of grey area here and your "customer" is the company. Telling the customer the whole truth, even if they don't like it, is unlikely what they want to be doing.
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@handsofqwerty said:
My job is to make the customer happy and the company money. My sales accomplish both.
Is that official policy or an assumption? Is it in writing?
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@handsofqwerty said:
- provide quality technical work, and that means quality from a professional standpoint, not a corporate one
Again, is this in writing from the company?
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
My job is to make the customer happy and the company money. My sales accomplish both.
Is that official policy or an assumption? Is it in writing?
No, that's policy. We push for warranties and tech work because it's very profitable for the company, and honestly it's also in the customer's best interest. Also, we are to make customer's happy because that affects CSAT scores and the like.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
- provide quality technical work, and that means quality from a professional standpoint, not a corporate one
Again, is this in writing from the company?
No, their standards are the corporate ones. I meet those and exceed them. But by doing that, I've built the long-term business and I've got a huge list of customers as proof of that.
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@handsofqwerty said:
Also, I told my tech supervisor that when I sign off on a computer, it's my name and reputation that I'm signing off on. Yes, the tech work is done at my retailer. But customers come back asking for me, many times years later. It's because I don't do shoddy work and I take the time to do it right, as well as engage the customer in a beyond-the-superficial manner.
Are you signing off that it is "perfect" or that you have met company standards? Signing off is not a generic exercise. That your customers come back asking for you is, again, a red herring. They are not your customers, they are the business' customers. The company is your customer, are they telling you, in writing, that what you are doing is perfect and not to listen to the tech manager? If not, you are making assumptions that have no foundation.
If you are only signing that your job is done, your reputation is still intact. Are they asking you to sign off on less than meeting their minimum standards?
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
Also, I told my tech supervisor that when I sign off on a computer, it's my name and reputation that I'm signing off on. Yes, the tech work is done at my retailer. But customers come back asking for me, many times years later. It's because I don't do shoddy work and I take the time to do it right, as well as engage the customer in a beyond-the-superficial manner.
Are you signing off that it is "perfect" or that you have met company standards? Signing off is not a generic exercise. That your customers come back asking for you is, again, a red herring. They are not your customers, they are the business' customers. The company is your customer, are they telling you, in writing, that what you are doing is perfect and not to listen to the tech manager? If not, you are making assumptions that have no foundation.
If you are only signing that your job is done, your reputation is still intact. Are they asking you to sign off on less than meeting their minimum standards?
No, I'm signing off that the work is completed to both the company's standards and mine.
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@handsofqwerty said:
No, their standards are the corporate ones. I meet those and exceed them. But by doing that, I've built the long-term business and I've got a huge list of customers as proof of that.
You have a long list of customers that are proof that you did something that we can't establish was good. Stop talking about making money, having customers, going above and beyond, etc. Those are assumptions that are unlikely to be true. You are injecting them as red herrings - they have no place here in the discussion. It doesn't matter at all that you have this list of customers or why you have them. Unless you can accept that those aren't your customers and "above and beyond" for someone that isn't your customer does not equate to above and beyond for your customer, the business, you can't state these things.
You may be correct, but what you are working on here are purely assumptions and not applicable to the case at hand. You seem to be very confused as to where your responsibilities lie. You are part of the business, not an independent consultant.
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@handsofqwerty said:
No, I'm signing off that the work is completed to both the company's standards and mine.
Where does it state that it is to your standards? Is that in writing? Unless it is, I feel you have made this up completely because you want it to be the case.
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@handsofqwerty said:
No, that's policy. We push for warranties and tech work because it's very profitable for the company, and honestly it's also in the customer's best interest. Also, we are to make customer's happy because that affects CSAT scores and the like.
Warranties are never in a customer's best interest. The company couldn't make money if they were. Warranties screw customers more than anything most shops sell.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
No, I'm signing off that the work is completed to both the company's standards and mine.
Where does it state that it is to your standards? Is that in writing? Unless it is, I feel you have made this up completely because you want it to be the case.
There is nothing in writing about that Scott. But the difference between shoddy and good tech work in many cases isn't spelled out word for word at most companies. But someone who's technical can tell the difference.
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@handsofqwerty said:
My comment was that customers don't know what they really want or need. They have needs. They have wants. My job is to find the best solution to address those. But I will almost certainly never do what the customer wants when they come in, unless they are really adamant about it. The reason is that customers just don't know. That's why they came to see me in the first place.
Obviously, but they are also violating the social contract of sales - asking for technical advice from a sales person. They know that they are doing this when they go in. It's just part of the social structure. When you go to a store and "ask for advice", you know that you are not getting good advice except for within a very carefully defined, socially accepted window and that even that is coloured by margins, stock levels, etc. There is no social obligation for you to do anything beyond push the products the store tells you to push, none. Not even the slightest. The store may decide that they want you to do more, but that is purely and unequivocally between you and them.
You are correct, if they knew what they wanted or needed they would not be in the shop at all. That's a tough position, but you are a sales person and you have an obligation to your employer to attempt to sell what they want you to sell. It's that simple. The "customers" of the store accept this obligation when they solicit free advice from you - they know that that advice is paid for by the sale and that your obligation is to making money for the store. Now, why anyone would still ask for that advice is beyond me, but everyone is aware of the relationship and what it means for you, for them and for the kind of advice that can be given.
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@handsofqwerty said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
No, I'm signing off that the work is completed to both the company's standards and mine.
Where does it state that it is to your standards? Is that in writing? Unless it is, I feel you have made this up completely because you want it to be the case.
There is nothing in writing about that Scott. But the difference between shoddy and good tech work in many cases isn't spelled out word for word at most companies. But someone who's technical can tell the difference.
And that matters why? You are signing off to the company's standards. Nothing suggests otherwise. You have decided to inject something that doesn't exist and use it as an excuse for doing a different job than the one mandated, right? That technical people can tell the difference has nothing to do with the situation. You are signing off that X was done. Was it done? yes or no. That you really want it to also mean Y doesn't mean that it does mean Y nor that you have any place in defining that.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@handsofqwerty said:
My comment was that customers don't know what they really want or need. They have needs. They have wants. My job is to find the best solution to address those. But I will almost certainly never do what the customer wants when they come in, unless they are really adamant about it. The reason is that customers just don't know. That's why they came to see me in the first place.
Obviously, but they are also violating the social contract of sales - asking for technical advice from a sales person. They know that they are doing this when they go in. It's just part of the social structure. When you go to a store and "ask for advice", you know that you are not getting good advice except for within a very carefully defined, socially accepted window and that even that is coloured by margins, stock levels, etc. There is no social obligation for you to do anything beyond push the products the store tells you to push, none. Not even the slightest. The store may decide that they want you to do more, but that is purely and unequivocally between you and them.
You are correct, if they knew what they wanted or needed they would not be in the shop at all. That's a tough position, but you are a sales person and you have an obligation to your employer to attempt to sell what they want you to sell. It's that simple. The "customers" of the store accept this obligation when they solicit free advice from you - they know that that advice is paid for by the sale and that your obligation is to making money for the store. Now, why anyone would still ask for that advice is beyond me, but everyone is aware of the relationship and what it means for you, for them and for the kind of advice that can be given.
I'm not told to push any specific computer or brand or anything. That's left up to me. As long as they buy it from my company, the company doesn't really care what I sell them.
