Why is the Third World Running Windows?
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@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@karlita said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller
Nicaragua does not use part of the technology that exists to protect the environment,"supposedly" since our country is lagging behind in technological matters, however, studies are being carried out on climate change in the country.That's something I'd love to help address. Using old technology, and Windows based AMD/Intel machines means that Nicaragua uses way more power than it should and has to have more tech waste flowing through the country. Newer, more power efficient, and smaller systems would do wonders for increasing technological capabilities while reducing the ecological impact.
One of the key reasons that the US and other countries dump old systems onto the Nicaragua market is because they are too environmentally impactful to run in the US, so we replace them and send the ones bad for the environment outside of the country.
While I don't disagree with that reasoning - it's literally the first time I've actually heard someone say it.
It's not so thoughtful, it's a series of decisions made in isolation. Companies retire equipment because it is too expensive to keep running. Then it goes to recyclers. They then can't resell in the US because it's too expensive to maintain. So then it goes to the third world.
No one says "ha, we'll dump this on poor, unsuspecting countries", it's just each step in the process evaluates the gear, decides it is too expensive to operate (mostly due to efficiency) and eventually it naturally flows to the third world where they aren't in a position to turn it down.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@karlita said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller
Nicaragua does not use part of the technology that exists to protect the environment,"supposedly" since our country is lagging behind in technological matters, however, studies are being carried out on climate change in the country.That's something I'd love to help address. Using old technology, and Windows based AMD/Intel machines means that Nicaragua uses way more power than it should and has to have more tech waste flowing through the country. Newer, more power efficient, and smaller systems would do wonders for increasing technological capabilities while reducing the ecological impact.
One of the key reasons that the US and other countries dump old systems onto the Nicaragua market is because they are too environmentally impactful to run in the US, so we replace them and send the ones bad for the environment outside of the country.
While I don't disagree with that reasoning - it's literally the first time I've actually heard someone say it.
It's not so thoughtful, it's a series of decisions made in isolation. Companies retire equipment because it is too expensive to keep running. Then it goes to recyclers. They then can't resell in the US because it's too expensive to maintain. So then it goes to the third world.
No one says "ha, we'll dump this on poor, unsuspecting countries", it's just each step in the process evaluates the gear, decides it is too expensive to operate (mostly due to efficiency) and eventually it naturally flows to the third world where they aren't in a position to turn it down.
Wouldn't the price still have to be so reduced that those other places would even buy them, that the price would also be low enough that it could stay in lower power costs places like the US?
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@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@karlita said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller
Nicaragua does not use part of the technology that exists to protect the environment,"supposedly" since our country is lagging behind in technological matters, however, studies are being carried out on climate change in the country.That's something I'd love to help address. Using old technology, and Windows based AMD/Intel machines means that Nicaragua uses way more power than it should and has to have more tech waste flowing through the country. Newer, more power efficient, and smaller systems would do wonders for increasing technological capabilities while reducing the ecological impact.
One of the key reasons that the US and other countries dump old systems onto the Nicaragua market is because they are too environmentally impactful to run in the US, so we replace them and send the ones bad for the environment outside of the country.
While I don't disagree with that reasoning - it's literally the first time I've actually heard someone say it.
It's not so thoughtful, it's a series of decisions made in isolation. Companies retire equipment because it is too expensive to keep running. Then it goes to recyclers. They then can't resell in the US because it's too expensive to maintain. So then it goes to the third world.
No one says "ha, we'll dump this on poor, unsuspecting countries", it's just each step in the process evaluates the gear, decides it is too expensive to operate (mostly due to efficiency) and eventually it naturally flows to the third world where they aren't in a position to turn it down.
Wouldn't the price still have to be so reduced that those other places would even buy them, that the price would also be low enough that it could stay in lower power costs places like the US?
Often they are shipped out for free. And at free, it's not worth running in the US.
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@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@karlita said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller
Nicaragua does not use part of the technology that exists to protect the environment,"supposedly" since our country is lagging behind in technological matters, however, studies are being carried out on climate change in the country.That's something I'd love to help address. Using old technology, and Windows based AMD/Intel machines means that Nicaragua uses way more power than it should and has to have more tech waste flowing through the country. Newer, more power efficient, and smaller systems would do wonders for increasing technological capabilities while reducing the ecological impact.
One of the key reasons that the US and other countries dump old systems onto the Nicaragua market is because they are too environmentally impactful to run in the US, so we replace them and send the ones bad for the environment outside of the country.
While I don't disagree with that reasoning - it's literally the first time I've actually heard someone say it.
It's not so thoughtful, it's a series of decisions made in isolation. Companies retire equipment because it is too expensive to keep running. Then it goes to recyclers. They then can't resell in the US because it's too expensive to maintain. So then it goes to the third world.
No one says "ha, we'll dump this on poor, unsuspecting countries", it's just each step in the process evaluates the gear, decides it is too expensive to operate (mostly due to efficiency) and eventually it naturally flows to the third world where they aren't in a position to turn it down.
Wouldn't the price still have to be so reduced that those other places would even buy them, that the price would also be low enough that it could stay in lower power costs places like the US?
Often they are shipped out for free. And at free, it's not worth running in the US.
really? to whom? My dad was acquiring old computers and giving them away to seniors in upstate NY for a while.
I can't believe they couldn't find takers for the old stuff here in the US.
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This is interesting but not something I have had to deal with yet in any capacity. If I ever do, what devices are better and more environmental friendly for users who need such things?
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@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@dashrender said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@karlita said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller
Nicaragua does not use part of the technology that exists to protect the environment,"supposedly" since our country is lagging behind in technological matters, however, studies are being carried out on climate change in the country.That's something I'd love to help address. Using old technology, and Windows based AMD/Intel machines means that Nicaragua uses way more power than it should and has to have more tech waste flowing through the country. Newer, more power efficient, and smaller systems would do wonders for increasing technological capabilities while reducing the ecological impact.
One of the key reasons that the US and other countries dump old systems onto the Nicaragua market is because they are too environmentally impactful to run in the US, so we replace them and send the ones bad for the environment outside of the country.
While I don't disagree with that reasoning - it's literally the first time I've actually heard someone say it.
It's not so thoughtful, it's a series of decisions made in isolation. Companies retire equipment because it is too expensive to keep running. Then it goes to recyclers. They then can't resell in the US because it's too expensive to maintain. So then it goes to the third world.
No one says "ha, we'll dump this on poor, unsuspecting countries", it's just each step in the process evaluates the gear, decides it is too expensive to operate (mostly due to efficiency) and eventually it naturally flows to the third world where they aren't in a position to turn it down.
Wouldn't the price still have to be so reduced that those other places would even buy them, that the price would also be low enough that it could stay in lower power costs places like the US?
Often they are shipped out for free. And at free, it's not worth running in the US.
really? to whom? My dad was acquiring old computers and giving them away to seniors in upstate NY for a while.
I can't believe they couldn't find takers for the old stuff here in the US.
Often cheaper to buy something practical than to use impractical free stuff. Even if they find takers, it screws them in most cases.
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@jmoore said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
This is interesting but not something I have had to deal with yet in any capacity. If I ever do, what devices are better and more environmental friendly for users who need such things?
I've been looking into an ARM based Linux desktop design for there. Low power like a phone or tablet. With Linux and non-GPU use desktops, you can get super efficient.
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@scottalanmiller Ok yeah that makes sense. I want to start looking into this too, even if only because I'm curious. Should be useful at some point.
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7 years ago, when I visiting developing country, pretty much any one living in an urban area had a cellphone, and I would imagine smartphones will have mostly taken over now.
I suppose businesses might use Windows desktops though
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@flaxking said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
7 years ago, when I visiting developing country, pretty much any one living in an urban area had a cellphone, and I would imagine smartphones will have mostly taken over now.
I suppose businesses might use Windows desktops though
Real businesses need computers the same as anywhere. They need to do bookkeeping, track inventory, etc. just like American businesses.
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@scottalanmiller I just read that Arm is risc. That changes everything. Risc is great, I just didnt realize they were the same thing. Researching this further
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@jmoore said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
@scottalanmiller I just read that Arm is risc.
ARM literally standards for Adanced RISC Machine.
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@jmoore said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
That changes everything. Risc is great, I just didnt realize they were the same thing. Researching this further
Aside from REALLY obscure processors that no one knows about....
AMD64 (all desktop procs you know today) and IA32 (the 32bit predecessors) are the ONLY CISC chips around.
IA64 (Itanium) which is dead, for all intents and purposes, was EPIC.Beyond those two special cases, all processors on the market for over twenty years are RISC.
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The last, popular CISC processor that wasn't part of the IA32/AMD64 family was the Motorola M68000 family used by Amiga and pre-UNIX MacOS. It died off in the 1990s.
The M88000 was its RISC sibling, but never got traction outside of the embedded space.
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What type of businesses are we talking about?
There are a lot of areas where Windows is the only game in town. -
So the popular RISC processors that we use regularly include...
ARM (in nearly all phones, tablets, and many netbooks that don't run Windows), Power (IBM's processor family), PowerPC (old Macs), Sparc (Oracle's server processors), MIPS (older servers, Nintendo 64, lots of NAS devices), PA-RISC (HP's forerunner to Itanium), Alpha (DEC's amazing server proc), etc.
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@pete-s said in Why is the Third World Running Windows?:
What type of businesses are we talking about?
There are a lot of areas where Windows is the only game in town.In the third world, Windows being the only game is pretty rare. There is extremely little use of proprietary apps.
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@scottalanmiller lol I see that now
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@scottalanmiller haha I've got an assembly book for the m68000
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@scottalanmiller I believe we have an old Alpha running some old software for some user
