This was a June 28th-thing...
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@tonyshowoff Great story, and it's basically the same I'm telling trainees on day one: observe, follow the path (OSI etc.), act later.
Thanks for sharing.
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@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
That's a pretty cool story, I say definitely nurture her technical side. I've noticed that in the west, especially America, there's a subcurrent of almost discouragement for girls to be interested in technology. It's vague, it's subtle, but it's certainly there.
I'd say it is more huge and in your face than vague or subtle. Girls are often outright faced (often from other women more than men) with "that's not a girl's job", or talk that girls won't be good at that kind of thing or, more often, just told that girls don't enjoy that kind of work.
The subtle stuff is mostly in the weird "get girls into STEM" stuff where they act like they are doing special STEM encouragement projects but really it is just a "treat girls differently and do less with them" process. My nieces suffer from this. Their schools offer all of this extra-curricular activities around robotics and programming and stuff... but none of it is even slightly technical or challenging and causes them to get even less exposure to computers and tech jobs than you would hope that you would get in a normal classroom. It's so bad that even with a school focus on engineering and programming by soon to graduate niece has never actually seen programming!
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@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
I guess that was kind of long, but I also see people on Spiceworks running into this thing a lot too. Sometimes I jump the gun myself and then when my initial suspicions are wrong, I remember to go back to the list.
I think that part of being a senior technician is knowing when to go with gut feelings rather than long processes. I've been known to eyeball latency in threads and pick out what was the problem. It's not some magic sauce, it's just loads of exposure with a decent empathy for the machine. That's a lot of what makes seniors faster, we know how things behave under different scenarios, know how the parts interact and can often guess what is wrong before proving it. A junior needs processes to prove it or else they are hit and miss all over the place. Seniors will often guess it the first time to save time and effort.
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@thanksajdotcom for a while that was the jewel in the collection. She was an ugly bitch (lol), but Windows 98 SE, 233-K6 processor, 54x CD-Rom/Burner, no modem, just an Ethernet port, 20GB HDD, oh and the best part, 512-MB SD Ram. I used to love to watch the beginning memtest, and the system count all of it.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
That's a pretty cool story, I say definitely nurture her technical side. I've noticed that in the west, especially America, there's a subcurrent of almost discouragement for girls to be interested in technology. It's vague, it's subtle, but it's certainly there.
I'd say it is more huge and in your face than vague or subtle. Girls are often outright faced (often from other women more than men) with "that's not a girl's job", or talk that girls won't be good at that kind of thing or, more often, just told that girls don't enjoy that kind of work.
Well I was just trying to be polite for all the Americans here. I've pointed out on Spiceworks many times in those types of threads that if women inherently dislike that kind of thing, why does Russia have more female engineers and doctors than male ones? Most of the programmers I've met here were women as well. It's not completely inverted in every case, but at the bear minimum is at least 50/50 on the low end. So if there's some sort of genetic predisposition to women not like technology, then for some reason Slavs don't seem to carry this. Of course the typical response is either silence or "well you'll never convince me otherwise [because I'm a lonely white guy in America who thinks women shouldn't like technology so I have a huge confirmation bias, my mom isn't a programmer, therefore women don't want to be.]"
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@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
That's a pretty cool story, I say definitely nurture her technical side. I've noticed that in the west, especially America, there's a subcurrent of almost discouragement for girls to be interested in technology. It's vague, it's subtle, but it's certainly there.
I'd say it is more huge and in your face than vague or subtle. Girls are often outright faced (often from other women more than men) with "that's not a girl's job", or talk that girls won't be good at that kind of thing or, more often, just told that girls don't enjoy that kind of work.
Well I was just trying to be polite for all the Americans here. I've pointed out on Spiceworks many times in those types of threads that if women inherently dislike that kind of thing, why does Russia have more female engineers and doctors than male ones? Most of the programmers I've met here were women as well. It's not completely inverted in every case, but at the bear minimum is at least 50/50 on the low end. So if there's some sort of genetic predisposition to women not like technology, then for some reason Slavs don't seem to carry this. Of course the typical response is either silence or "well you'll never convince me otherwise [because I'm a lonely white guy in America who thinks women shouldn't like technology so I have a huge confirmation bias, my mom isn't a programmer, therefore women don't want to be.]"
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
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@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
Which is just sad. I actually encouraged a couple ladies to apply for help-desk positions lately. They don't know IT specifically, but they're good at following directions, and probably quicker than me in actually learning the why behind actions. They're also a lot better interacting with people than I am (I know, you're all soooo surprised by that
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@travisdh1 said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
Which is just sad. I actually encouraged a couple ladies to apply for help-desk positions lately. They don't know IT specifically, but they're good at following directions, and probably quicker than me in actually learning the why behind actions. They're also a lot better interacting with people than I am (I know, you're all soooo surprised by that
)Did any of them decide to do it? Other than my wife, I don't think that I've ever talked any woman into going into any IT job, and I've talked to many. For my wife it took a few of us working in IT, her directly seeing how much better our jobs and work/life balance was, how much more we were paid and knowing that we were all college drop outs (she was a forensic bio-chemist trained and employed) before she considered it.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@travisdh1 said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
Which is just sad. I actually encouraged a couple ladies to apply for help-desk positions lately. They don't know IT specifically, but they're good at following directions, and probably quicker than me in actually learning the why behind actions. They're also a lot better interacting with people than I am (I know, you're all soooo surprised by that
)Did any of them decide to do it? Other than my wife, I don't think that I've ever talked any woman into going into any IT job, and I've talked to many. For my wife it took a few of us working in IT, her directly seeing how much better our jobs and work/life balance was, how much more we were paid and knowing that we were all college drop outs (she was a forensic bio-chemist trained and employed) before she considered it.
That reminds me another thing I see a lot from the sexist American IT guys is usually this idea that women are being forced into technology jobs against their will. It's a similar argument to "women just don't like technical jobs," but even dumber.
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@tonyshowoff said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@travisdh1 said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
Which is just sad. I actually encouraged a couple ladies to apply for help-desk positions lately. They don't know IT specifically, but they're good at following directions, and probably quicker than me in actually learning the why behind actions. They're also a lot better interacting with people than I am (I know, you're all soooo surprised by that
)Did any of them decide to do it? Other than my wife, I don't think that I've ever talked any woman into going into any IT job, and I've talked to many. For my wife it took a few of us working in IT, her directly seeing how much better our jobs and work/life balance was, how much more we were paid and knowing that we were all college drop outs (she was a forensic bio-chemist trained and employed) before she considered it.
That reminds me another thing I see a lot from the sexist American IT guys is usually this idea that women are being forced into technology jobs against their will. It's a similar argument to "women just don't like technical jobs," but even dumber.
I've not really seen that one. But I'm not surprised.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@travisdh1 said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
Which is just sad. I actually encouraged a couple ladies to apply for help-desk positions lately. They don't know IT specifically, but they're good at following directions, and probably quicker than me in actually learning the why behind actions. They're also a lot better interacting with people than I am (I know, you're all soooo surprised by that
)Did any of them decide to do it? Other than my wife, I don't think that I've ever talked any woman into going into any IT job, and I've talked to many. For my wife it took a few of us working in IT, her directly seeing how much better our jobs and work/life balance was, how much more we were paid and knowing that we were all college drop outs (she was a forensic bio-chemist trained and employed) before she considered it.
I haven't talked to them since. They both had already had an interview as secretaries. I need to contact some other people I know, see if anything is even available in the area right now. I'll probably be seeing both of them in the next week or two, so we'll see.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@dafyre said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Ironically 3 of my last 4 jobs the IT Directors were women, lol. And they were GOOD at IT, not just meh.
In the US it is considered acceptable for women to be managers, but not technicians. Women in IT often go into management very quickly. Or start in management without coming through IT.
They were both. One of them was also a programmer... She was so good at hacking around in the code of one company's software, they'd call HER if they had a problem they couldn't fix.
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@acs77043 said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@thanksajdotcom for a while that was the jewel in the collection. She was an ugly bitch (lol), but Windows 98 SE, 233-K6 processor, 54x CD-Rom/Burner, no modem, just an Ethernet port, 20GB HDD, oh and the best part, 512-MB SD Ram. I used to love to watch the beginning memtest, and the system count all of it.
It was a great story. I still chuckle every time I think about it. I believe the term "going all redneck/Jeff Foxworthy on it" was used in the conversation at one point, but I can't remember with 100% certainty. Lol
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Hey @acs77043 have you shown this to your daughter?
https://mangolassi.it/topic/9942/looking-for-highshool-it-intern/
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Hey @acs77043 have you shown this to your daughter?
https://mangolassi.it/topic/9942/looking-for-highshool-it-intern/
He already said she's only like 11...
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@thanksajdotcom said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Hey @acs77043 have you shown this to your daughter?
https://mangolassi.it/topic/9942/looking-for-highshool-it-intern/
He already said she's only like 11...
Ah, okay. Probably too young then.
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@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@thanksajdotcom said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
@scottalanmiller said in This was a June 28th-thing...:
Hey @acs77043 have you shown this to your daughter?
https://mangolassi.it/topic/9942/looking-for-highshool-it-intern/
He already said she's only like 11...
Ah, okay. Probably too young then.
Yup, just a bit...
