I've been working on IT security for about 5 years now, and I have been recently continuing my education.

I've been with my current employer about a year, but I'm constantly being offered more money to leave. Sometimes the upward of 20-30k of an increase.

I've gone up to the interview a few times and demanded more money than they were offering originally and have yet to be turned down. Although I have decided to stop through process before the interview several times.

I like my current employer and they are giving me room to grow with training however I feel that I may be tapped out on the technical side. I am only eligible for one more promotion before I'm maxed out as a tech.

The next option is management and this employer requires a 4 year degree for that. I have no degree and about 15 years total IT experience, so at this point I'm not sure a degree would help me for the amount of effort required.

@wirestyle22 said in Feedback on Resume:

Updated a bit. Ignore formattting for now. I'm just focusing on information and then I will format it. I am having a little trouble explaining what I do at my current job because it's all over the place. Really, I'm doing desktop support but I also have to handle all of the appliances and servers as well, sporadically.

Separate resumes could highlight different skills at each job. For example If going for a windows admin, you can highlight server OSes, AD, DNS, SCCM, WSUS, etc. Then maybe you have a Linux catered resume where you still mention windows proficiency, but you highlight more on Linux experience.

@wirestyle22 said in Feedback on Resume:

Updated a bit. Ignore formattting for now. I'm just focusing on information and then I will format it. I am having a little trouble explaining what I do at my current job because it's all over the place. Really, I'm doing desktop support but I also have to handle all of the appliances and servers as well, sporadically.

Separate resumes could highlight different skills at each job. For example If going for a windows admin, you can highlight server OSes, AD, DNS, SCCM, WSUS, etc. Then maybe you have a Linux catered resume where you still mention windows proficiency, but you highlight more on Linux experience.

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

Well, except for the cost of lost opportunity. How much career advancement do you give up to sit in a low paying shop that isn't really focused on excellence? A year is a lot of career time to sacrifice.

Potentially none. That is the entire point you are ignoring.

Depending on how the project goes he could move to C level and be subsequently ahead of where he would be if he moves now.

It is not always black and white Scott.

Sure that's true - but if HR is truly the one holding back pay raises - then they are equally as likely to keep pay for any new C-levels low or non existent.
The markings of bad management are already there.

And it sounds like HR has the power to ban him from being the one that gets that C level position, regardless of the work that he does.

That's where I want to be eventually, but I don't see that happening awhile at least 7-8 years. I gotta put my dues in and I'm OK with that. I just want to make sure I'm able to take the next step. I'm not necessarily looking at the farthest one too closely yet.

That's a long time for someone who already has experience. I would think that even without an amazing break that you could significantly reduce that.

How do you transition from a technical to management? That's kind of tough for someone with no management experience.

Well, read some books, ask to get involved, sometimes you just do it and... is it what you really want? Are you LOOKING to make a career change?

So you think if I read some books on the matter, companies will let me get involved? I'm not sure how that works

You think that is less likely that letting you get involved with nothing? Reading books and being interested in it is MORE than what university does. And it's how I got into it

I could see that, but it seems even less likely to go from technical to management with no experience to show.

You have a long history of consultation. Which is a serious of many decisions with an outlook at the overall picture. While I've made plenty of recommendations and worked plenty of projects and implementation. I've never had final decision authority.

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

Well, except for the cost of lost opportunity. How much career advancement do you give up to sit in a low paying shop that isn't really focused on excellence? A year is a lot of career time to sacrifice.

Potentially none. That is the entire point you are ignoring.

Depending on how the project goes he could move to C level and be subsequently ahead of where he would be if he moves now.

It is not always black and white Scott.

Sure that's true - but if HR is truly the one holding back pay raises - then they are equally as likely to keep pay for any new C-levels low or non existent.
The markings of bad management are already there.

And it sounds like HR has the power to ban him from being the one that gets that C level position, regardless of the work that he does.

That's where I want to be eventually, but I don't see that happening awhile at least 7-8 years. I gotta put my dues in and I'm OK with that. I just want to make sure I'm able to take the next step. I'm not necessarily looking at the farthest one too closely yet.

That's a long time for someone who already has experience. I would think that even without an amazing break that you could significantly reduce that.

How do you transition from a technical to management? That's kind of tough for someone with no management experience.

Well, read some books, ask to get involved, sometimes you just do it and... is it what you really want? Are you LOOKING to make a career change?

So you think if I read some books on the matter, companies will let me get involved? I'm not sure how that works

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

Well, except for the cost of lost opportunity. How much career advancement do you give up to sit in a low paying shop that isn't really focused on excellence? A year is a lot of career time to sacrifice.

Potentially none. That is the entire point you are ignoring.

Depending on how the project goes he could move to C level and be subsequently ahead of where he would be if he moves now.

It is not always black and white Scott.

Sure that's true - but if HR is truly the one holding back pay raises - then they are equally as likely to keep pay for any new C-levels low or non existent.
The markings of bad management are already there.

And it sounds like HR has the power to ban him from being the one that gets that C level position, regardless of the work that he does.

That's where I want to be eventually, but I don't see that happening awhile at least 7-8 years. I gotta put my dues in and I'm OK with that. I just want to make sure I'm able to take the next step. I'm not necessarily looking at the farthest one too closely yet.

That's a long time for someone who already has experience. I would think that even without an amazing break that you could significantly reduce that.

How do you transition from a technical to management? That's kind of tough for someone with no management experience.

It probably would require taking a paycut and going to SMB?

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

Well, except for the cost of lost opportunity. How much career advancement do you give up to sit in a low paying shop that isn't really focused on excellence? A year is a lot of career time to sacrifice.

Potentially none. That is the entire point you are ignoring.

Depending on how the project goes he could move to C level and be subsequently ahead of where he would be if he moves now.

It is not always black and white Scott.

Sure that's true - but if HR is truly the one holding back pay raises - then they are equally as likely to keep pay for any new C-levels low or non existent.
The markings of bad management are already there.

And it sounds like HR has the power to ban him from being the one that gets that C level position, regardless of the work that he does.

That's where I want to be eventually, but I don't see that happening awhile at least 7-8 years. I gotta put my dues in and I'm OK with that. I just want to make sure I'm able to take the next step. I'm not necessarily looking at the farthest one too closely yet.

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@scottalanmiller said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

Well, except for the cost of lost opportunity. How much career advancement do you give up to sit in a low paying shop that isn't really focused on excellence? A year is a lot of career time to sacrifice.

Potentially none. That is the entire point you are ignoring.

Depending on how the project goes he could move to C level and be subsequently ahead of where he would be if he moves now.

It is not always black and white Scott.

One of my favorite quotes is by Wayne Gretzky. "you miss 100% of the shots you don't take." I've taken alot of shots in my life. Sometimes they've drifted far left from the goal post, but I've also scored some real beauties. Overall I'm better off in life.

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

I am a type that would grab an opportunity that works with my life, and this sounds exactly like something I woudl do in your position.

Security related work will be in huge demands for years to come.

So I would take this risk and stay on for a year. If it fails, move on. You are out a bit of a short term wage increase in that instance, but the potential long term is higher faster. Risk vs. Reward, only you can make that call.

That's exactly the time frame I was thinking. See what happens in another year. I agree that the demand is high and not going away anytime soon. So either way I will be in a a better place in a year.

@JaredBusch said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

Don't allow the company to make excuses that hinder your growth. If they can't keep up with the other companies in your area/field, then you have no choice but to leave.

But, if they really are a good company, they will make these changes rapidly, as needed to keep good employees.

You also missed this point..

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

One of the appealing things about my current role is I have an opportunity to build something from the ground up. I wouldn't be qualified to do this type of niche within information security otherwise. The serious upside is that this role could potentially double my salary. However if the program doesn't take off then I could potentially waste quite a bit of time money (potential higher salary)

So it sounds like there is more than jsut higher wages elsewhere involved here. It sounds like a startup within a larger enterprise.

That kind of thing can be lucrative. Just like any other start up.

Something similar to this, but no quite. I have the opportunity to be the lead on something that SMBs would never have. Every enterprise and government organization has this area of information security though. It's somewhat less technical than what I've done in the past, but I'm starting to see a top out in the technical part of my career anyway.

I could have more money right now if I wanted because the demand is so high its ridiculous, but I don't think I'd have the opportunity to do what I am doing now somewhere else. If I can establish this area, it could potentially pay off huge.

It could potentially put me in the path of a C level position. There would be another step after this, but I wouldn't be far off.

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

On fact, they were so worried they pulled my department into a special meeting and promised increases if we stay. Those increases were somewhat substantial, but security in the local area is paying more still

Sounds like someone found a way around the HR monster.

Which makes me think it won't happen again. One negotiation with HR is difficult enough. It took 6 months to happen

you have weak leadership at the company then.

Leadership is the one that made the change initially. They had to create a new department, job titles, etc

@Dashrender said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

@Some_user said in Should I stay or should I go now?:

On fact, they were so worried they pulled my department into a special meeting and promised increases if we stay. Those increases were somewhat substantial, but security in the local area is paying more still

Sounds like someone found a way around the HR monster.

Which makes me think it won't happen again. One negotiation with HR is difficult enough. It took 6 months to happen