If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@MattSpeller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
Being stuck in one location to me is comparable to false imprisonment. Which is equatable to slavery in that you aren't free to do what you want.
So to say "if you can't travel, that's just less options" is equatable to slavery in that you aren't able to do what you want.
I really mean no offence but you're way way... way off the mark.
Being unable to travel is in no way, shape or form similar to being owned.
Let's for example use the old mining companies in the America's. These companies would build towns, railroads, and housing, ship people in and pay them a wage. But the only place they could shop was the local store, which was owned by the Mining company. (along with the rail-road and everything else).
If the employees wanted to leave, they were forced to walk, the Mining company railroad wouldn't transport them.
They were hundreds of miles away from anything, so walking clearly isn't an option. So they are forced to stay in the Mining Village. But to stay they were forced to work, to "earn" money and spend said money at the store.
This is a form of slavery.
I don't see how we as modern humans could ever be forced to travel at the schedule of a business. Ever.
No, that was a form of servitude. Not the same thing. It was in no way slavery. And they could get rides, walk, higher a horse or whatever. They accepted one way transportation willingly. They had every option to buy a car, horse, whatever and get there on their own. Nothing even remotely like slavery. Slavery isn't optional.
Have you kept up on your history of the coal mines? These people were very much slaves to the businesses that brought them in. 14-16 hour days, and no choices for anything.
They were trapped in the area in which the mine existed.
Sure they chose to go and work for the mining company, but they had very little choice once there. Almost none.
Reasons this is false:
- Choice
- Not trapped
It's that simple. They had every right to not take the job, not keep the job, walk away.
You said it yourself, they were in a servitude relationship. With slavery like environments and working conditions.
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I'm not saying that they didn't have massive incentive to stay, that the mines weren't evil or that life wasn't tough. I'm saying that there was nothing like slavery about it. Were they attacked by the mining company if they quit and started walking? Did the government return them to the mine if they made it to another town?
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
You said it yourself, they were in a servitude relationship. With slavery like environments and working conditions.
I also said that servitude isn't slavery. It's optional so not applicable.
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
I'm not saying that they didn't have massive incentive to stay, that the mines weren't evil or that life wasn't tough. I'm saying that there was nothing like slavery about it. Were they attacked by the mining company if they quit and started walking? Did the government return them to the mine if they made it to another town?
Were they attacked by the mining company if they quit and started walking?
yes, yes they were in fact attacked and forced to stay.
Did the government return them to the mine if they made it to another town?
No, they didn't do this, but the government did turn a blind eye for a very long time. Which is almost as bad.
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If servitude is the same as slavery... and not being able to own a car is slavery... then not having bought a car is servitude and since servitude and slavery are both slavery... everyone who doesn't own a car is a slave.
That's the logical breakdown that happens if those things equal those other things.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
I'm not saying that they didn't have massive incentive to stay, that the mines weren't evil or that life wasn't tough. I'm saying that there was nothing like slavery about it. Were they attacked by the mining company if they quit and started walking? Did the government return them to the mine if they made it to another town?
Were they attacked by the mining company if they quit and started walking?
yes, yes they were in fact attacked and forced to stay.
If they were ATTACKED then sure they were slaves but none of this has to do with transportation and the point is unrelated to the discussion about transportation!
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
You said it yourself, they were in a servitude relationship. With slavery like environments and working conditions.
I also said that servitude isn't slavery. It's optional so not applicable.
Servitude isn't optional once your involved. You clearly don't have a way to pay of the debt incurred, so you're force to work for assholes.
Anyways this is detracting from the topic.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
Servitude isn't optional once your involved.
Neither is falling, but the fact that you chose to jump is what makes it optional.
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
If servitude is the same as slavery... and not being able to own a car is slavery... then not having bought a car is servitude and since servitude and slavery are both slavery... everyone who doesn't own a car is a slave.
That's the logical breakdown that happens if those things equal those other things.
No, you skewing the topic. I said a restriction of transportation to the transportation providers being large businesses (privately held) would essentially be slavery.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
You clearly don't have a way to pay of the debt incurred, so you're force to work for assholes.
Like anyone who goes into debt over their head. But that is their own decision. It's not related to slavery.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
No, you skewing the topic. I said a restriction of transportation to the transportation providers being large businesses (privately held) would essentially be slavery.
Yes... and we showed that it is NOT like slavery. Because lack of transportation isn't related to slavery. If it were, the government not providing roads would be slavery. It is not. That's why the mines aren't related... they used force to make slaves, not a lack of transportation.
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Tons of people lack private transportation today. My next door neighbours don't even have a horse. They are not slaves. Not in the least. Yet they cannot possibly get a car.
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
Tons of people lack private transportation today. My next door neighbours don't even have a horse. They are not slaves. Not in the least. Yet they cannot possibly get a car.
Is there a business or other agency that would keep them from leaving?
Are they free to up and leave? If so this topic doesn't apply. This derailment began when it was brought up about having autonomous mass transportation and privately held transportation was no longer available.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
Tons of people lack private transportation today. My next door neighbours don't even have a horse. They are not slaves. Not in the least. Yet they cannot possibly get a car.
Is there a business or other agency that would keep them from leaving?
Are they free to up and leave? If so this topic doesn't apply. This derailment began when it was brought up about having autonomous mass transportation and privately held transportation was no longer available.
But they don't have either. So.... how does it not apply?
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I'm so confused... you are saying that if the government took away your car, you'd be a slave. but people who can't get a car today are not slaves.
What makes one a slave and one not a slave? What about kids who aren't allowed to have cars, are they slaves? The poor? People who live in dense urban centers? What about people who live in places where cars already do not exist?
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@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
I'm so confused... you are saying that if the government took away your car, you'd be a slave. but people who can't get a car today are not slaves.
People who live in large urban areas and have their movement restricted in any way (forms of transportation here) by freedom of movement are in essence being held against their will. Because they have no way to get around. IE Walking from NY to Florida is perfect OK, but completely unrealistic.
What makes one a slave and one not a slave? What about kids who aren't allowed to have cars, are they slaves? The poor? People who live in dense urban centers? What about people who live in places where cars already do not exist?
What makes one a slave (imprisoned to your region) would be if you were restricted to your movements on someone else's schedule
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
@scottalanmiller said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
I'm so confused... you are saying that if the government took away your car, you'd be a slave. but people who can't get a car today are not slaves.
People who live in large urban areas and have their movement restricted in any way (forms of transportation here) by freedom of movement are in essence being held against their will. Because they have no way to get around. IE Walking from NY to Florida is perfect OK, but completely unrealistic.
I'm actually planning to walk farther than that for a project. Not allowing cars is NOT restricting movement. That's a totally different thing. We aren't talking about restricting movement.
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@DustinB3403 said in If you thought Skynet was just a story why is google building an AI kill switch:
What makes one a slave (imprisoned to your region) would be if you were restricted to your movements on someone else's schedule
Imprisonment and slavery are different concepts. If you are restricted by others, that's a form of imprisonment. But no one is being restricted by not being allowed to own their own cars.
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Here is the quandary that I posed to @DustinB3403 in an IM that I think solves all issues...
The emperor of Rome, the most powerful person in the world, had no car and was restricted in movement the same as, in fact far far worse than, anyone not allowed to have a car today.
Was the emperor of Rome a slave because of this lack of cars? And if so... to whom?
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@DustinB3403 Cars are a privilege not a right, for one. You arent forced to not go anywhere, you can go whereever you choose, just not in a car in your hypothetical sitrep.
