Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?
-
@dafyre said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Wow, what a thread. For a smaller number of users, I think RDSH is the way to go. I am currently running a small farm of Remote Apps with this on Server 2012 R2 servers. (I have 60-something apps available to end-users) across 8 servers (6 Virtual for regular apps, and 2 Physical for heavy hitters like Photoshop and Premiere).
Our apps range from a Windows 3.1-ish look and feel up to Office 2013 (soon to be 2016!) and heavy hitters like Adobe Photoshop, and Adobe Premiere. And thus far, from our users, we rarely hear performance complaints.
That's a pretty big farm for an SMB.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@dafyre said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Wow, what a thread. For a smaller number of users, I think RDSH is the way to go. I am currently running a small farm of Remote Apps with this on Server 2012 R2 servers. (I have 60-something apps available to end-users) across 8 servers (6 Virtual for regular apps, and 2 Physical for heavy hitters like Photoshop and Premiere).
Our apps range from a Windows 3.1-ish look and feel up to Office 2013 (soon to be 2016!) and heavy hitters like Adobe Photoshop, and Adobe Premiere. And thus far, from our users, we rarely hear performance complaints.
That's a pretty big farm for an SMB.
College for the win, lol. It counts each individual program in something like Office as a separate App, so a large portion of that are suites, like Office, and Adobe products.
RDSH 2012 R2 isn't as big of a pain to set up as I see most people saying. The biggest issue I've had with it is actually getting SSO to work consistently, and I figured that out at the end of last week.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Its nice that you can replicated everything to the cloud for DR, but man Azure's new GUI sure is a headache compared to the one I was using a couple years back.
Hard to believe that it could get worse
The terrible interfaces and unintuitive system are some of the reasons that I like to avoid it. It is a huge pain to do anything on it compared to the alternatives.But things like capacity based MS SQL Server are big bonuses of it.
And yeah it is amazingly worst. And I still hate that the RDS Gateways are a requirement. It complicated an otherwise simple installation for a small setup like ours. If we are lucky we MAY have 20 people by end of year and I doubt we add a person or two per year at peak growth.
What makes you require an RDS gateway?
Perhaps instead of on Prem, you should go for Colo. You're own hardware with your own firewalls.
I'm not aware of them ever being required.
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Its nice that you can replicated everything to the cloud for DR, but man Azure's new GUI sure is a headache compared to the one I was using a couple years back.
Hard to believe that it could get worse
The terrible interfaces and unintuitive system are some of the reasons that I like to avoid it. It is a huge pain to do anything on it compared to the alternatives.But things like capacity based MS SQL Server are big bonuses of it.
And yeah it is amazingly worst. And I still hate that the RDS Gateways are a requirement. It complicated an otherwise simple installation for a small setup like ours. If we are lucky we MAY have 20 people by end of year and I doubt we add a person or two per year at peak growth.
What makes you require an RDS gateway?
Perhaps instead of on Prem, you should go for Colo. You're own hardware with your own firewalls.
I'm not aware of them ever being required.
This is what I was getting at. If he's forced to use RDS gateways at Vultr, it because he can't control the firewall and doesn't want RDP directly on the internet (which RDS gives you anyway I believe, but default) then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@bigbear said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Its nice that you can replicated everything to the cloud for DR, but man Azure's new GUI sure is a headache compared to the one I was using a couple years back.
Hard to believe that it could get worse
The terrible interfaces and unintuitive system are some of the reasons that I like to avoid it. It is a huge pain to do anything on it compared to the alternatives.But things like capacity based MS SQL Server are big bonuses of it.
And yeah it is amazingly worst. And I still hate that the RDS Gateways are a requirement. It complicated an otherwise simple installation for a small setup like ours. If we are lucky we MAY have 20 people by end of year and I doubt we add a person or two per year at peak growth.
What makes you require an RDS gateway?
Perhaps instead of on Prem, you should go for Colo. You're own hardware with your own firewalls.
I'm not aware of them ever being required.
This is what I was getting at. If he's forced to use RDS gateways at Vultr, it because he can't control the firewall and doesn't want RDP directly on the internet (which RDS gives you anyway I believe, but default) then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
Yeah, but he DOESN'T need it, you see. That's the thing.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... it because he can't control the firewall and doesn't want RDP directly on the internet ....
Leaps of logic or missed things leading to more bad things. What firewall has he lost control of and how does that cause this issue? How does any amount of not wanting RDP directly on the Internet lead to "RDS being required"?
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
But let me take a stab.
so don't respond yetWould you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
Again, assumptions. Why is a VPN needed? Where did that come from?
And... you put it behind one the same that you do anywhere else. There's nothing special here. How would you do it at a colo or at home or at the office? Same way here.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
But let me take a stab.
so don't respond yetSorry, responded before you said not to respond.
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
Again, assumptions. Why is a VPN needed? Where did that come from?
And... you put it behind one the same that you do anywhere else. There's nothing special here. How would you do it at a colo or at home or at the office? Same way here.
At a colo the servers are behind a firewall, there is NO way for them to reach the internet other than through the firewall... the firewall is also a VPN concentrator.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Would you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
That's one option. Or just put the VPN service directly on the server in question. Depends on what you want. If you are using VPNs like ZeroTier, you'll never even realize that there is something "to do" as it all "just works" without thinking about it at all. Or maybe you have a VPN aggregator at your office (like OpenVPN) and your RDP clients are just clients of it, no need for a VPN "server" on the VPS side of things at all.
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
Again, assumptions. Why is a VPN needed? Where did that come from?
You mentioned that most people want to use RDP over VPN, so the need for an RDS gateway is often not needed. This was a solution - not a requirement.
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Would you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
That's one option. Or just put the VPN service directly on the server in question. Depends on what you want. If you are using VPNs like ZeroTier, you'll never even realize that there is something "to do" as it all "just works" without thinking about it at all. Or maybe you have a VPN aggregator at your office (like OpenVPN) and your RDP clients are just clients of it, no need for a VPN "server" on the VPS side of things at all.
I'm completely unfamiliar with the RDP client being a VPN client at the same time.
-
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Would you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
That's one option. Or just put the VPN service directly on the server in question. Depends on what you want. If you are using VPNs like ZeroTier, you'll never even realize that there is something "to do" as it all "just works" without thinking about it at all. Or maybe you have a VPN aggregator at your office (like OpenVPN) and your RDP clients are just clients of it, no need for a VPN "server" on the VPS side of things at all.
OK yeah ZT could be awesome in this situation.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
At a colo the servers are behind a firewall, there is NO way for them to reach the internet other than through the firewall... the firewall is also a VPN concentrator.
No, at a colo you have servers in a rack. If you add a firewall, and add a VPN to that, and if you make the machines talk through it... those are all configurations that you decided to add and use. All things you can do and commonly do do with someone like Vultr. You have an assumption that "colo means firewall with VPN" and that "cloud host does not", but those are both just your assumptions. You can easily have a colo without a firewall, and you can easily have Vultr with one.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
... then moving to colo would possibly allow him to solve this.
How? Same issues exist. Same solutions exist.
How do you put VPS behind a VPN at a system like Vultr? It's a network engineering question I don't know the answer to.
Again, assumptions. Why is a VPN needed? Where did that come from?
You mentioned that most people want to use RDP over VPN, so the need for an RDS gateway is often not needed. This was a solution - not a requirement.
Right but you stated it as if without RDS, VPN was the only option.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Would you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
That's one option. Or just put the VPN service directly on the server in question. Depends on what you want. If you are using VPNs like ZeroTier, you'll never even realize that there is something "to do" as it all "just works" without thinking about it at all. Or maybe you have a VPN aggregator at your office (like OpenVPN) and your RDP clients are just clients of it, no need for a VPN "server" on the VPS side of things at all.
I'm completely unfamiliar with the RDP client being a VPN client at the same time.
I'm not sure what to tell you, this is incredibly common. To the point of nearly expectation in many environments. Think about any home user or remote worker that has a Windows desktop that you support from the LAN. That's the same thing, literally. They have a VPN client on their desktop, their desktop is an RDP client. I'm not sure what aspect of VPNs is making this non-obvious so not sure what part to explain.
-
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@scottalanmiller said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
@Dashrender said in Has Windows 10 VDI Licensing changed yet?:
Would you setup a VPN server on a host at Vultr (or anywhere really), and then set it up so the Vultr instances are only allowed to talk to the IPs from that VPN server?
all things taking place on the same interface on the VPN server?
That's one option. Or just put the VPN service directly on the server in question. Depends on what you want. If you are using VPNs like ZeroTier, you'll never even realize that there is something "to do" as it all "just works" without thinking about it at all. Or maybe you have a VPN aggregator at your office (like OpenVPN) and your RDP clients are just clients of it, no need for a VPN "server" on the VPS side of things at all.
OK yeah ZT could be awesome in this situation.
But not unique. Pertino actually used this example as their primary use case when first release - for providing simplified remote access. It was so much their focus that they built the RDP over Pertino stuff into their interface.
