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    Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion

    IT Discussion
    fibre channel networking switching iso osi network stack
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    • travisdh1T
      travisdh1 @dafyre
      last edited by

      @dafyre said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

      @scottalanmiller said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

      @dafyre said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

      @scottalanmiller said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

      So my question then would be, in your view of the OSI model and what iSCSI does, where would you put it in the stack knowing that it is the "final deliverable" of the communications in question and that it will be consumed directly by the final application and that it plays no role in the delivery, it is the thing "to be delivered." Where would you put it knowing what it is?

      I might could go to Presentation layer, but still leaning towards Session.

      The Application layer would be the tools you use to configure your OS to interact with the iSCSI device that is "presented" to the OS... ie: iSCSI Initiator on Windows.

      You are outside of the network stack completely. In the OSI model, L7 is the Application Layer of the network stack. It is still networking protocols. It can never be something that a user touches. Users touch Applications, applications put the Application Layer communications on the wire, which is then encapsulated by the stack. The network stack does not include things that users ever see like desktops, applications, files, languages and such.

      I see why this is getting confused. You are trying to include the entire computer in the network stack, not just the network protocols.

      You are probably right. I spend so much time focusing on the "whole computer" aspect of things that I don't get elbow deep in terminology like this enough.

      I've slept a few times since I first learned of the OSI model, lol.

      To be fair, the OSI model training I had at the college level was absolutely terrible with things like NFS being included in the stack.... it's little wonder nobody in the class really understood what they were trying to teach when the people writing books and teaching don't really understand the subject.

      scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
      • scottalanmillerS
        scottalanmiller @travisdh1
        last edited by

        @travisdh1 said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

        @dafyre said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

        @scottalanmiller said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

        @dafyre said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

        @scottalanmiller said in FibreChannel Switch Types:

        So my question then would be, in your view of the OSI model and what iSCSI does, where would you put it in the stack knowing that it is the "final deliverable" of the communications in question and that it will be consumed directly by the final application and that it plays no role in the delivery, it is the thing "to be delivered." Where would you put it knowing what it is?

        I might could go to Presentation layer, but still leaning towards Session.

        The Application layer would be the tools you use to configure your OS to interact with the iSCSI device that is "presented" to the OS... ie: iSCSI Initiator on Windows.

        You are outside of the network stack completely. In the OSI model, L7 is the Application Layer of the network stack. It is still networking protocols. It can never be something that a user touches. Users touch Applications, applications put the Application Layer communications on the wire, which is then encapsulated by the stack. The network stack does not include things that users ever see like desktops, applications, files, languages and such.

        I see why this is getting confused. You are trying to include the entire computer in the network stack, not just the network protocols.

        You are probably right. I spend so much time focusing on the "whole computer" aspect of things that I don't get elbow deep in terminology like this enough.

        I've slept a few times since I first learned of the OSI model, lol.

        To be fair, the OSI model training I had at the college level was absolutely terrible with things like NFS being included in the stack.... it's little wonder nobody in the class really understood what they were trying to teach when the people writing books and teaching don't really understand the subject.

        NFS should be there, just up top at L7 🙂

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • scottalanmillerS
          scottalanmiller
          last edited by

          I've renaming this thread.

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
          • StrongBadS
            StrongBad
            last edited by

            Good discussion!

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • JaredBuschJ
              JaredBusch
              last edited by gjacobse

              This thread hurt my head....

              I have been poring over pcaps in Wireshark all afternoon.

              How do people not get this? The OSI model is a conceptualization for communication methods. aka the f***ing network.
              if it is not part of the network then it is not part of the model.

              Calling part of hte payload part of the model (beyond saying it is the payload) is just stupid...

              wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
              • wirestyle22W
                wirestyle22 @JaredBusch
                last edited by

                @JaredBusch said in Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion:

                How do people not get this?

                Think back to when you were studying and didn't fully understand a concept. Like social cues or empathy

                coliverC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • coliverC
                  coliver
                  last edited by

                  I always assumed iSCSI was at the application layer because it's in the name. iSCSI is literally SCSI commands encapsulated in TCP/IP packets.

                  scottalanmillerS 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • coliverC
                    coliver @wirestyle22
                    last edited by

                    @wirestyle22 said in Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion:

                    Like social cues or empathy

                    Glad I'm not the only one who finds picking up on these things next to impossible.

                    wirestyle22W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • wirestyle22W
                      wirestyle22 @coliver
                      last edited by

                      @coliver said in Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion:

                      @wirestyle22 said in Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion:

                      Like social cues or empathy

                      Glad I'm not the only one who finds picking up on these things next to impossible.

                      true neutral

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • scottalanmillerS
                        scottalanmiller @coliver
                        last edited by

                        @coliver said in Diving into the ISO OSI Network Stack Discussion:

                        I always assumed iSCSI was at the application layer because it's in the name. iSCSI is literally SCSI commands encapsulated in TCP/IP packets.

                        Good way to think of it.

                        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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