MangoCon 2016 NYS
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@Dashrender said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@Dashrender said:
I'm going to be running so tight on vacation - I'm hoping I can make it.
Maybe you can get work to consider it work time?
I get 5 days a year and $2500 for training/travel/etc - at least 3 days of that is taken by SpiceWorld.
Ah, so in theory they do that, you are just using a lot already. At least you have some left!
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@scottalanmiller said:
@Dashrender said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@Dashrender said:
I'm going to be running so tight on vacation - I'm hoping I can make it.
Maybe you can get work to consider it work time?
I get 5 days a year and $2500 for training/travel/etc - at least 3 days of that is taken by SpiceWorld.
Ah, so in theory they do that, you are just using a lot already. At least you have some left!
Yeah, I'm not sure if she's hitting Tuesday or not, I worked a half day and traveled the rest.
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Hopefully it won't be in winter. But that would lower the cost of facilities, I bet.
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Next week Jenny and I are scoping locations. So I will have more details after then I hope!
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@Minion-Queen said:
Next week Jenny and I are scoping locations. So I will have more details after then I hope!
What about scoping dates?
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@Dashrender said:
I get 5 days a year
I'm sorry, but WHAT!?
You only get 5 days annual leave (vacation)? -
@nadnerB said:
@Dashrender said:
I get 5 days a year
I'm sorry, but WHAT!?
You only get 5 days annual leave (vacation)?Pretty confident that he means five days of training days to use. But in the US five days of annual leave is not all that uncommon, actually.
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@Dashrender said:
I get 5 days a year and $2500 for training/travel/etc - at least 3 days of that is taken by SpiceWorld. While I paid a non insignificant amount on a room ($750 for 4 nights), and $299 for SW itself, and $370 for flights, over all it was pretty cheap because I didn't have to buy any meals while I was there. There might be enough to do both next year.
Your SW ticket should have cost you $99 if you purchased at con. If not you can get it for $199 now. So that is $100-$200 less there.
You could share a room next year and halve the hotel (AirBnB).
The flight, is probably always going to be similar. -
@scottalanmiller said:
But in the US five days of annual leave is not all that uncommon, sadly.
FTFY
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@nadnerB said:
You only get 5 days annual leave (vacation)?
I have no paid time off at all. So there is that. Instead my hourly wage was initially set higher than average for my duties.
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@JaredBusch said:
@nadnerB said:
You only get 5 days annual leave (vacation)?
I have no paid time off at all. So there is that. Instead my hourly wage was initially set higher than average for my duties.
I spent eight years that way. It's not all that uncommon. I knew lots of people who had done similar things at many different companies. Definitely not the norm by any stretch, but not super uncommon.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Pretty confident that he means five days of training days to use.
Oh, righto.
But in the US five days of annual leave is not all that uncommon, actually.
Wowzers, that's nuts.
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@scottalanmiller said:
I spent eight years that way. It's not all that uncommon. I knew lots of people who had done similar things at many different companies. Definitely not the norm by any stretch, but not super uncommon.
You simply have to make sure you properly account for the wages as desired.
Example (not my real rate):
You make $25/hour (x2087 hours = $52,175/year) and get 2 weeks (80 hours) of paid vacation time.
This comes out to $2,000 per year for those 80 hours.
Divide that by 2,087 (US standard work hours in a year) breaks it down to $0.96 per hour.
So take $1/hour more on the offer, means you make $26/hour.
Assuming you still take 2 weeks off, that comes up to $26 * 2007 = $52,182/year.
It also means any paid overtime will be worth more. -
Yeah, the US is terrible on vacation stuff. Although you know, honestly, having been to a few different places the Europeans and more heavily European influenced countries (Australia, New Zealand, Canada) they have this feeling like people should have loads of vacation (and I agree) but in much of the rest of the world people often get little or no vacation. The US actually falls in the middle. Sure it is at the bottom of developed nations for holiday time, but when you compare India and China and Central America, for example, it's more like average.
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@JaredBusch said:
I have no paid time off at all. So there is that. Instead my hourly wage was initially set higher than average for my duties.
We have that but that's termed 'casual' employment. Lots of the big companies (Woolies, Coles, Maccas etc i.e. the ones where kids/students start) put most people on as casuals. It works out cheaper for them.
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@JaredBusch said:
@scottalanmiller said:
I spent eight years that way. It's not all that uncommon. I knew lots of people who had done similar things at many different companies. Definitely not the norm by any stretch, but not super uncommon.
You simply have to make sure you properly account for the wages as desired.
Example (not my real rate):
You make $25/hour (x2087 hours = $52,175/year) and get 2 weeks (80 hours) of paid vacation time.
This comes out to $2,000 per year for those 80 hours.
Divide that by 2,087 (US standard work hours in a year) breaks it down to $0.96 per hour.
So take $1/hour more on the offer, means you make $26/hour.
Assuming you still take 2 weeks off, that comes up to $26 * 2007 = $52,182/year.
It also means any paid overtime will be worth more.Exactly, and if you are like me, I did it mostly in the years when I did not have kids yet. So I just didn't take vacations most years so I earned that much more and did not start looking for the vacation time until later in my career. That can lead to burn out, but I never intended to do it forever. I did manage to go twenty years with no normal vacations, though, taking just one for my honeymoon.
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@nadnerB said:
@JaredBusch said:
I have no paid time off at all. So there is that. Instead my hourly wage was initially set higher than average for my duties.
We have that but that's termed 'casual' employment. Lots of the big companies (Woolies, Coles, Maccas etc i.e. the ones where kids/students start) put most people on as casuals. It works out cheaper for them.
Here (in the US, not actually where I am) it is the opposite. The more casual you are, the more you are protected and get vacation time of some sort. It's the hard core consultants who should be in a position to make their own adult life choices that might end up in that position. Which is, I think, a very good thing. People like Jared know what it means, how to handle it and how to make it work for them. It ends up being important flexibility rather than some horrible loss. But a twenty year old that is desperate to get an entry level job should not fear slave labour that they can't afford to escape.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Exactly, and if you are like me, I did it mostly in the years when I did not have kids yet. So I just didn't take vacations most years so I earned that much more and did not start looking for the vacation time until later in my career. That can lead to burn out, but I never intended to do it forever. I did manage to go twenty years with no normal vacations, though, taking just one for my honeymoon.
I did not get the job until after I had kids. But I also got more than the "minimum" offset for the time. We still take vacations, just small ones. But that is because of a time dedication in Japan that is not vacation, but still eats available time.
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Back before the kids I would do things like travel to offices around the world but work while there and take @dominica with me. This worked out great. We got a week in the UK out of that that we really enjoyed. We went and did a weekend (I didn't normally work weekends) in the British countryside, then I worked in London, then it was Thanksgiving in the US (I did get ten holidays a year so this was a day off for me) that we spent doing our own thing, then Friday I worked in Belfast and that weekend we had to ourselves in Belfast.
A vacation it was not, but we got five days of "not working" time in the UK out of it plus Dominica got free time there while I did four days of "work time" too. So with a little creativity things worked out really well during those years. Not perfect and I really have valued by vacation time since then, especially my two months that I took in 2012 after my twenty year vacationless stretch, but I think it was the right decision during those years.
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What is interesting, to me at least, is that I have been so focused on vacation time as being critical in the years since changing out of that vacationless job and my one job had for or more weeks and the next had five.... but in both cases, even though I was super serious about the vacation time, I ended up taking a vacation buyout rather than actually taking vacation time! I took a little at the one job in 2013, but only one week and only in Walt Disney World (does that even count as a vacation?)
