A slow descent into burnout
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@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
I'm doing this stuff all day, studying in the evenings, going in on the weekends to do updates and maintenance while everyone else is out, and not getting any free time to just relax and get work off of the brain. When I am at work I feel like I don't have the ability to focus on the tasks I am trying to accomplish without fairly regular interruptions.
Bottom line is... don't do this. Put the burden on your manager or employer. Don't work weekends except for very special emergencies or projects. If you need to do weekends or evenings with any regularity then you do that instead of working worthless daytime hours. If people make you unable to focus, don't ask, tell them that they are blocking you from working so you now work from home - if they don't like it, all extra hours require outside contractors to do because they don't need you this tired, they are doing it because they can get away with it. They are wasting your time and burning you out. Don't let them. No other role would accept that behaviour, don't empower them to do it to you or the next IT guy.
The major problem, I think, is that we are just understaffed overall. Since I started working here in late 2013, we've been progressively busier and busier and they are having problems finding enough capable people to fill positions fast enough. My boss is a really talented developer/engineer and easily one of the most productive people I've ever worked with. He probably works closer to a 60 hour week on his normal schedule, and probably accomplishes anywhere from 80-120 hours worth of work. Here recently we have had NUMEROUS employees putting in weeks that are in excess of 100 hours.
The coming in on weekends and evenings I put on myself. I could probably squeeze a lot of the basic maintenance in during the week with few complaints from anyone. I personally just try to keep anything I do from interfering with the productivity of the Engineers and Developers. A lot of these people are putting in some ridiculous hours in comparison to my schedule and I just don't want to contribute any extra stress to their workloads. I actually really like the people I work with and for; I've learned quite a bit here and I really do feel valued.
Even when I do come in weekends/evening I try to keep my hours under 50 for the week. Yes, that doesn't always play out as planned, but I do make the effort. The work itself is just feeling less than rewarding lately and I'm not getting the same enjoyment out of it.
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@RamblingBiped said:
The coming in on weekends and evenings I put on myself. I could probably squeeze a lot of the basic maintenance in during the week with few complaints from anyone. I personally just try to keep anything I do from interfering with the productivity of the Engineers and Developers. A lot of these people are putting in some ridiculous hours in comparison to my schedule and I just don't want to contribute any extra stress to their workloads. I actually really like the people I work with and for; I've learned quite a bit here and I really do feel valued.
Nothing wrong with choosing to work weekends and off hours... but your manager should be forcing you to take comp time to make up for it. Burn out isn't good for anyone. Burnout creates turnover and even lower productivity.
What's causing the inability to hire?
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@RamblingBiped said:
Even when I do come in weekends/evening I try to keep my hours under 50 for the week. Yes, that doesn't always play out as planned, but I do make the effort. The work itself is just feeling less than rewarding lately and I'm not getting the same enjoyment out of it.
Ah, that's not bad then. 50 is standard for a professional week in the US.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
The coming in on weekends and evenings I put on myself. I could probably squeeze a lot of the basic maintenance in during the week with few complaints from anyone. I personally just try to keep anything I do from interfering with the productivity of the Engineers and Developers. A lot of these people are putting in some ridiculous hours in comparison to my schedule and I just don't want to contribute any extra stress to their workloads. I actually really like the people I work with and for; I've learned quite a bit here and I really do feel valued.
Nothing wrong with choosing to work weekends and off hours... but your manager should be forcing you to take comp time to make up for it. Burn out isn't good for anyone. Burnout creates turnover and even lower productivity.
What's causing the inability to hire?
I really think it is mostly a regional thing. Not many developers/engineers are drawn to working in the Midwest (Kenuckiana specifically) without some previous attachment to the area. There are so many other opportunities out there right now in warmer more culturally diverse cities that it is just a tough sell. And a lot of the people that they interview right out of college just don't have the skills required to work with a lot of the products we develop, even in a reasonable entry-level position.
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@RamblingBiped said:
I really think it is mostly a regional thing. Not many developers/engineers are drawn to working in the Midwest (Kenuckiana specifically) without some previous attachment to the area. There are so many other opportunities out there right now in warmer more culturally diverse cities that it is just a tough sell. And a lot of the people that they interview right out of college just don't have the skills required to work with a lot of the products we develop, even in a reasonable entry-level position.
We had that problem in Dallas, no one would even interview there. But that's what H1Bs are for. Literally, that's what they are for. Or they need to relocate the job to where there are the skills or just raise the rates. The midwest has to pay much higher for the same skills as the coasts because while the money "goes further" it's not the same. People who don't want to live in the midwest see it as a lower standard of living (no theatre, no trains, etc.)
That's why you don't hire IT in the midwest, you put those people elsewhere or work from home. Development especially has no reason to be on site.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
How tough of a sell would I currently be for an entry-level position? Is it even realistic to pursue an opportunity before my undergraduate's degree is finished? (I do hold an Assoiciates of Science with a focus on CS)
No good manager will care about the degree if you can show aptitude and knowledge. I know 10x developers with no degree who can get any job that they want. You'll probably want to do a portfolio piece in your position, but the degree itself will only hold you back from horrible jobs that you don't want anyway.
This is right along the lines of what I was thinking.
I'm at the point that I think I'm just suffering from lack of creative outlet. The part of my job I have enjoyed most recently has revolved around writing scripts and building tools to automate tasks and provide a solution to a problem. Everything else is starting to feel stagnant and repetitious. I feel like I might thrive in a development position where I could be a member of a team and focus on a few tasks/projects/responsibilities versus organizing and prioritizing ever changing lists of 20 projects.
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@RamblingBiped said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
How tough of a sell would I currently be for an entry-level position? Is it even realistic to pursue an opportunity before my undergraduate's degree is finished? (I do hold an Assoiciates of Science with a focus on CS)
No good manager will care about the degree if you can show aptitude and knowledge. I know 10x developers with no degree who can get any job that they want. You'll probably want to do a portfolio piece in your position, but the degree itself will only hold you back from horrible jobs that you don't want anyway.
This is right along the lines of what I was thinking.
I'm at the point that I think I'm just suffering from lack of creative outlet. The part of my job I have enjoyed most recently has revolved around writing scripts and building tools to automate tasks and provide a solution to a problem. Everything else is starting to feel stagnant and repetitious. I feel like I might thrive in a development position where I could be a member of a team and focus on a few tasks/projects/responsibilities versus organizing and prioritizing ever changing lists of 20 projects.
you sound more like a project manager half the time
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@RamblingBiped said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
How tough of a sell would I currently be for an entry-level position? Is it even realistic to pursue an opportunity before my undergraduate's degree is finished? (I do hold an Assoiciates of Science with a focus on CS)
No good manager will care about the degree if you can show aptitude and knowledge. I know 10x developers with no degree who can get any job that they want. You'll probably want to do a portfolio piece in your position, but the degree itself will only hold you back from horrible jobs that you don't want anyway.
This is right along the lines of what I was thinking.
I'm at the point that I think I'm just suffering from lack of creative outlet. The part of my job I have enjoyed most recently has revolved around writing scripts and building tools to automate tasks and provide a solution to a problem. Everything else is starting to feel stagnant and repetitious. I feel like I might thrive in a development position where I could be a member of a team and focus on a few tasks/projects/responsibilities versus organizing and prioritizing ever changing lists of 20 projects.
That's why I like MSP work. You get to work with professionals in your field rather than tons of random people. We still support lots of random people, but we get to be IT focused, mentored, etc.
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@MattSpeller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
How tough of a sell would I currently be for an entry-level position? Is it even realistic to pursue an opportunity before my undergraduate's degree is finished? (I do hold an Assoiciates of Science with a focus on CS)
No good manager will care about the degree if you can show aptitude and knowledge. I know 10x developers with no degree who can get any job that they want. You'll probably want to do a portfolio piece in your position, but the degree itself will only hold you back from horrible jobs that you don't want anyway.
This is right along the lines of what I was thinking.
I'm at the point that I think I'm just suffering from lack of creative outlet. The part of my job I have enjoyed most recently has revolved around writing scripts and building tools to automate tasks and provide a solution to a problem. Everything else is starting to feel stagnant and repetitious. I feel like I might thrive in a development position where I could be a member of a team and focus on a few tasks/projects/responsibilities versus organizing and prioritizing ever changing lists of 20 projects.
you sound more like a project manager half the time
Yeah, except the only person I have to delegate any responsibilities to is myself! lol
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@RamblingBiped said:
Yeah, except the only person I have to delegate any responsibilities to is myself! lol
Do you listen well and take direction?
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If I had to manage me, I'd kill me.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@RamblingBiped said:
Yeah, except the only person I have to delegate any responsibilities to is myself! lol
Do you listen well and take direction?
I grumble and complain to myself regularly, but I usually get things done.
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Now I need to get off of here and get myself back to work on planning hypervisor upgrades, learning powershell and subsequently finish writing all of the audit scripts that want/need to implement for Active Directory, Google Apps, our release servers, and version control systems, and look into building an apt-repository with multi-factor authentication for software package distribution to debian/ubuntu clients.
Oh, and in my free time, building an OpenVPN server on an EC2 instance in Singapore for low-latency secure access to services for an employee that will be traveling to China the first week of April (just got notified yesterday).
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@RamblingBiped said:
Looking to brighten the light at the end of the tunnel. Any advice is appreciated...
Working full time in a challenging job and doing a degree is really, really hard! Once you've finished your degree things might look a lot clearer. I'd hang on in there until then.
Maybe you just need a holiday to recharge your batteries? At the very least, you need to take your foot of the gas for a month or two to prevent burnout and plan a few relaxing weekends with friends and family.
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Sounds like the problem may lie with the job itself. Doing a degree on top of that would be extremely challenging!
I am a Sysadmin as well, and currently going through an ovehaul to prove myself more appealing to the current market. I found the regular route quite stale so I took some online courses and started studying cloud and devops stuff. It's amazing how much traction you can get if you're willing to start at the bottom again. With all that experience and the new on the job experience, I'm sure within a couple of years, you can put yourself in a really good position that you would enjoy
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@aaron said:
@RamblingBiped said:
going in on the weekends to do updates and maintenance while everyone else is out, and not getting any free time to just relax and get work off of the brain.
This is what causes burn out and what has burned me out before. Schedule maintenance windows during the day and tough luck. IT works 24/7 as it is, no reason for routine things to take away from your limited weekends.
Or, what we did at the big bank that needed to not have any risk or interruption during trading hours was.... we would always be scheduled to work Friday night (after trading closed for the week) and Saturday morning. Always, we could schedule around it years in advance. No surprises. Everyone everywhere knew that we all worked these hours and busted hump during them. In exchange we got time off during the week, like no work on Monday mornings. It all depends on your situation, but you change things around to make up for it. For us it wasn't dramatic, mostly for me it was that Friday nights went late - so Fridays always meant coming in two hours late and taking a super long lunch so the late Friday night work wasn't bad.
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@Carnival-Boy said:
Working full time in a challenging job and doing a degree is really, really hard! Once you've finished your degree things might look a lot clearer. I'd hang on in there until then.
That's true, a big bit of stress and time will change suddenly when that happens. I did 50+ hours a week in grunt labour for basically minimum wage while going to college and it was horrible. But it also got me through debt free with zero loans, zero assistance, zero cost breaks paying totally out of pocket with a degree and a great resume as quickly as possible. So while it was a rough time period, it really paid off.
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I think the root of my problem right now really is just needing a vacation. A REAL vacation where I don't have to see or think about anything work related for an entire week. The closest thing I have to that is coming up at the end of April in the form of a 24 hour trail relay series in Virginia... (Oh yeah, I've also been training for that in my "free" time). In addition to race day I have a couple extra days for recoup and travel time. Then, a week and a half later, I'm heading North to spend a week and a half hitting breweries and wineries across Wisconsin and Michigan. THAT will hopefully help my attitude and outlook.
If not it will at the very least give me some ideas for new beer recipes and a trunk full of booze.
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@RamblingBiped said:
I think the root of my problem right now really is just needing a vacation. A REAL vacation where I don't have to see or think about anything work related for an entire week.
I went from 1992 to 2012 with only my ten day honeymoon in 2004. That sucked. I did another two years of no vacations after 2012 but that was my limit. I won't skip them now. Well, now I'm retired, it's all vacation, lol.
