So You Want To Retire Rich eh?





  • That's not enough to retire on!



  • Well Scott - if you were able to get a 6 percent return on 1 million and you had no debt, it might work.



  • @Bob-Beatty nobody's getting 6% on anything without risking your principal 🙂



  • @Nic said:

    @Bob-Beatty nobody's getting 6% on anything without risking your principal 🙂

    Principal is always at risk.



  • @scottalanmiller said:

    @Nic said:

    @Bob-Beatty nobody's getting 6% on anything without risking your principal 🙂

    Principal is always at risk.

    There is always some inherent risk with any investment.



  • And the more conservative you try to be, generally the riskier you are.



  • I figure that I'd need about $3.1M to retire.



  • @Nara said:

    I figure that I'd need about $3.1M to retire.

    That's a more reasonable number.



  • @scottalanmiller said:

    @Nara said:

    I figure that I'd need about $3.1M to retire.

    That's a more reasonable number.

    For a couple, yeah 3.1M at 4% assuming you don't want to eat into the base would probably be enough - assuming you have no other debt. Damn, saving $3k/month to get there, Ouch!



  • Give me good health at 65 and I am happy. Money cant buy good health.



  • @Dashrender said:

    @scottalanmiller said:

    @Nara said:

    I figure that I'd need about $3.1M to retire.

    That's a more reasonable number.

    For a couple, yeah 3.1M at 4% assuming you don't want to eat into the base would probably be enough - assuming you have no other debt. Damn, saving $3k/month to get there, Ouch!

    Don't forget inflation! 3.1's good for one person to lead a comfortable yet not very active lifestyle in about 30 years or so.



  • @Bill-Kindle I want a 6% return, boy where those statistics come from can be really amaying, some high ranking banker.
    try more like .5 to 1.2 %



  • @Marcelo said:

    @Bill-Kindle I want a 6% return, boy where those statistics come from can be really amaying, some high ranking banker.
    try more like .5 to 1.2 %

    If you're talking a normal savings account you can easily be this low, but if you're invested in the market in stocks and bonds, it shouldn't be that hard to get 5-6%.
    My portfolio did something like 15% last year.



  • @Dashrender said:

    @Marcelo said:

    @Bill-Kindle I want a 6% return, boy where those statistics come from can be really amaying, some high ranking banker.
    try more like .5 to 1.2 %

    If you're talking a normal savings account you can easily be this low, but if you're invested in the market in stocks and bonds, it shouldn't be that hard to get 5-6%.
    My portfolio did something like 15% last year.

    Never invest in bonds. There is no riskier investment - except for savings accounts, of course. Fixed income investing is for full time, hard core investors. Super, ultra risky and never pays off except for really short term. You really have to know what you are doing to put anything in bonds.

    Even the most conservative investing generally gets around 8%. Which is why college doesn't pay off, the cost of college invested conservatively (nowhere near 15%) over a working lifetime dwarfs the potential extra earning that a degree can provide.



  • I find that normal savings are hard to get a very good return. Investing, well i have family so there is little in terms of investing, being in Europe does not help as a lot of investing here is hard to get into. Not going to try stocks and bonds, enough bad expiriences ni the past by friends and bad bankers have not helped.



  • @Marcelo said:

    I find that normal savings are hard to get a very good return. Investing, well i have family so there is little in terms of investing, being in Europe does not help as a lot of investing here is hard to get into. Not going to try stocks and bonds, enough bad expiriences ni the past by friends and bad bankers have not helped.

    They actually produce a negative return, that's why banks are willing to guarantee them.



  • @Marcelo said:

    Not going to try stocks and bonds, enough bad expiriences ni the past by friends and bad bankers have not helped.

    There should never be a banker (or friend, lol) involved in your stock investments. If there is, that's going to end badly. Bankers are expensive and have no particular expertise in investing and no vested interest in doing well for you even if they could.

    Disclaimer: I put in an eight year career in investment banking.



  • @scottalanmiller said:

    @Marcelo said:

    Not going to try stocks and bonds, enough bad expiriences ni the past by friends and bad bankers have not helped.

    There should never be a banker (or friend, lol) involved in your stock investments. If there is, that's going to end badly. Bankers are expensive and have no particular expertise in investing and no vested interest in doing well for you even if they could.

    Disclaimer: I put in an eight year career in investment banking.

    what if your friend is a proven money manager?



  • @Hubtech said:

    @scottalanmiller said:

    @Marcelo said:

    Not going to try stocks and bonds, enough bad expiriences ni the past by friends and bad bankers have not helped.

    There should never be a banker (or friend, lol) involved in your stock investments. If there is, that's going to end badly. Bankers are expensive and have no particular expertise in investing and no vested interest in doing well for you even if they could.

    Disclaimer: I put in an eight year career in investment banking.

    what if your friend is a proven money manager?

    That's the same logic that leads people to talk to bankers. Only do that stuff if you already have your nest egg and feel that it is time to be extra risky and try more dangerous things.



  • Specualtion is a very good game when you make money, but when you loose it, its annoying and you wonder if the guy did not just loose it so he could make some, friend or not. Very simplistic view but i dn't like bankers or people who try and sell you a product that a bank is selling. they make so much money and then we get punished because of bad investment decisions, but the individual bankers don't get hurt when they play on the sotckmarket.



  • @scottalanmiller you're right I didn't mean bonds, I meant Mutual Funds. Now the question - are you cool with those?



  • @Dashrender said:

    @scottalanmiller you're right I didn't mean bonds, I meant Mutual Funds. Now the question - are you cool with those?

    No, they are just a means of hiring a manager as a group. You are still paying humans to make bad decisions.



  • @Marcelo said:

    Specualtion is a very good game when you make money, but when you loose it, its annoying and you wonder if the guy did not just loose it so he could make some, friend or not. Very simplistic view but i dn't like bankers or people who try and sell you a product that a bank is selling. they make so much money and then we get punished because of bad investment decisions, but the individual bankers don't get hurt when they play on the sotckmarket.

    Agreed, don't use them.



  • How do you invest then?



  • @Dashrender said:

    How do you invest then?

    Index Funds. Well known as the most conservative means of reliable investing. They have always outperformed any other category. They have the lowest overhead so inherently carry a fraction of the normal risk. There are no people to get emotional or crazy.



  • I don't, can't. i have a family and in Germany the system for retirement is different, you are required, by law to pay into retirement, the more the better, but yeah, its a different system, and i don't have money i can lose.



  • @Marcelo said:

    I don't, can't. i have a family and in Germany the system for retirement is different, you are required, by law to pay into retirement, the more the better, but yeah, its a different system, and i don't have money i can lose.

    We do both here. We have to pay some into SS. Then we "have" to use things like 401K (insane if you don't.) Then extra you put wherever you want.



  • @scottalanmiller said:

    @Marcelo said:

    I don't, can't. i have a family and in Germany the system for retirement is different, you are required, by law to pay into retirement, the more the better, but yeah, its a different system, and i don't have money i can lose.

    We do both here. We have to pay some into SS. Then we "have" to use things like 401K (insane if you don't.) Then extra you put wherever you want.

    Insane if you don't as long as the employer is offering any type of matching.



  • @Dashrender said:

    @scottalanmiller said:

    @Marcelo said:

    I don't, can't. i have a family and in Germany the system for retirement is different, you are required, by law to pay into retirement, the more the better, but yeah, its a different system, and i don't have money i can lose.

    We do both here. We have to pay some into SS. Then we "have" to use things like 401K (insane if you don't.) Then extra you put wherever you want.

    Insane if you don't as long as the employer is offering any type of matching.

    Even if they don't there are good tax advantages.


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