Adobe Acrobat 7 Pro: CD / Download
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@StrongBad said:
Wait, if you get forms in Word, how did you not know that they exist?
I'm saying you generally create the form in Word. You put the check boxes, blank fields, etc all in Word. However, you make them fillable and customize that fillable-ness in Acrobat.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham that is an odd reaction. Why would you feel that way?
Because forms are, by standard, in PDF.
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@ajstringham said:
I'm saying you generally create the form in Word. You put the check boxes, blank fields, etc all in Word. However, you make them fillable and customize that fillable-ness in Acrobat.
Because, typically, you like to do things poorly? Why would you use one tool to do what it is good at and then convert to another format, that requires more cost, and isn't as good at what you are trying to do? Why would you do that?
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@ajstringham said:
Because forms are, by standard, in PDF.
Because users are idiots, sure. But why would you encourage such a thing? It just makes people look uninformed. It doesn't reflect well on people to show that they are spending money unwisely.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
I'm saying you generally create the form in Word. You put the check boxes, blank fields, etc all in Word. However, you make them fillable and customize that fillable-ness in Acrobat.
Because, typically, you like to do things poorly? Why would you use one tool to do what it is good at and then convert to another format, that requires more cost, and isn't as good at what you are trying to do? Why would you do that?
A PDF with fillable forms is more locked down. People can't, as a rule, change the wording of the forms, etc. All they can do is fill-in fields that have been marked as fillable. Can you do that with Word?
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@ajstringham said:
A PDF with fillable forms is more locked down. People can't, as a rule, change the wording of the forms, etc. All they can do is fill-in fields that have been marked as fillable. Can you do that with Word?
Of course. Why would you assume otherwise?
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
Because forms are, by standard, in PDF.
Because users are idiots, sure. But why would you encourage such a thing? It just makes people look uninformed. It doesn't reflect well on people to show that they are spending money unwisely.
Why is forms being PDFs as a rule stupid? Also, one thing to consider, is that PDFs are more universal. If I give you a DOCX made in Office 2013 and you open it in Office 2010, there WILL BE some differences in how it renders. Formatting is preserved more correctly, and universally, in PDF. Also, with the fact that LibreOffice can now handle DOCX, opening a form still in Word format in that will also change the formatting. That's what makes it less professional.
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@ajstringham said:
Why is forms being PDFs as a rule stupid?
Because it is more costly and complicated without benefit.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
A PDF with fillable forms is more locked down. People can't, as a rule, change the wording of the forms, etc. All they can do is fill-in fields that have been marked as fillable. Can you do that with Word?
Of course. Why would you assume otherwise?
Still, generally formatting is more subjective in Word documents than a PDF. PDFs are more static than Word. That's why they were created.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
Why is forms being PDFs as a rule stupid?
Because it is more costly and complicated without benefit.
Wrong. See previous posts about formatting.
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@ajstringham said:
If I give you a DOCX made in Office 2013 and you open it in Office 2010, there WILL BE some differences in how it renders.
No, they render identically. Where did you get this idea? And why would you edit in an old version? That makes no sense if there was an issue, you'd just update like you do with Acrobat Reader.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
If I give you a DOCX made in Office 2013 and you open it in Office 2010, there WILL BE some differences in how it renders.
No, they render identically. Where did you get this idea? And why would you edit in an old version? That makes no sense if there was an issue, you'd just update like you do with Acrobat Reader.
See, this is where you're not thinking bigger scale. We're talking about businesses. Just because your business that generates the form has Office 2013 doesn't mean the business you send it to isn't running Office 2007 or 2010. And while it does often render them the same, I've seen plenty of documents made in Office 2007/2010/2013 that are then opened with another version, usually going from newer to older, render different with things like placement of images, custom formatting, etc. All those are common factors when making a form for a business.
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@ajstringham said:
Also, with the fact that LibreOffice can now handle DOCX, opening a form still in Word format in that will also change the formatting.
What do you mean by "can now" edit DOCX files? LibreOffice came from OpenOffice which came from StarOffice which has been able to work in Word formats since day one in the early 1990s.
But the formatting is never 100% with LibreOffice, but that is completely irrelevant to the conversation. Why are you bringing it up? I could come up with third party PDF readers that don't render identically too.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
If I give you a DOCX made in Office 2013 and you open it in Office 2010, there WILL BE some differences in how it renders.
No, they render identically. Where did you get this idea? And why would you edit in an old version? That makes no sense if there was an issue, you'd just update like you do with Acrobat Reader.
It's Adobe Reader, or Adobe Acrobat, not Acrobat Reader...FYI
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@ajstringham said:
Still, generally formatting is more subjective in Word documents than a PDF. PDFs are more static than Word. That's why they were created.
Sure, but we are specifically discussing non-static content. Word for dynamic content, PDFs for perfectly formed finals. Forms are not really finals.
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@ajstringham said:
@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
Why is forms being PDFs as a rule stupid?
Because it is more costly and complicated without benefit.
Wrong. See previous posts about formatting.
The one that was wrong?
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@ajstringham said:
See, this is where you're not thinking bigger scale. We're talking about businesses. Just because your business that generates the form has Office 2013 doesn't mean the business you send it to isn't running Office 2007 or 2010.
Same with PDFs. So this argument makes no sense. You need to keep Adobe tools up to date. Any company can run current Windows readers, so that is a moot point. I think you are confused about how to read Word documents and making assumptions based on that.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
Also, with the fact that LibreOffice can now handle DOCX, opening a form still in Word format in that will also change the formatting.
What do you mean by "can now" edit DOCX files? LibreOffice came from OpenOffice which came from StarOffice which has been able to work in Word formats since day one in the early 1990s.
But the formatting is never 100% with LibreOffice, but that is completely irrelevant to the conversation. Why are you bringing it up? I could come up with third party PDF readers that don't render identically too.
Yes, LibreOffice could always edit .DOC, but NOT DOCX. DOCX is a more recent development, being the past year or two. Also, PDFs always render the same. Opening a PDF in Adobe, Nitro, CutePDF, or Foxit will always render the same result. Besides, PDF readers are free, and you can use a PDF reader to input into into a fillable form. There are computers at companies that don't have Word, and what happens when that happens? Now you are requiring paid software for a basic task.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
Still, generally formatting is more subjective in Word documents than a PDF. PDFs are more static than Word. That's why they were created.
Sure, but we are specifically discussing non-static content. Word for dynamic content, PDFs for perfectly formed finals. Forms are not really finals.
That's exactly what a form is. A form is a final template basically. The form itself rarely changes. You just give someone the form and they input their info, but the form itself isn't dynamic. The fields are, and that's where your confusion is coming in.
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@StrongBad said:
@ajstringham said:
See, this is where you're not thinking bigger scale. We're talking about businesses. Just because your business that generates the form has Office 2013 doesn't mean the business you send it to isn't running Office 2007 or 2010.
Same with PDFs. So this argument makes no sense. You need to keep Adobe tools up to date. Any company can run current Windows readers, so that is a moot point. I think you are confused about how to read Word documents and making assumptions based on that.
As a rule, people need Adobe Reader, which is free and can be kept up-to-date quite easily by any number of means, from Patch Management with GFI to Ninite. I'm not confused about how to read Word documents. There are Word DOC/DOCX reader programs, which are generally free, but they are completely static readers. They aren't like Adobe Reader.
