Migrate to DFS from UNC file shares? Complications..
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@ntoxicator said:
They were prospecting and projecting employee's based upon client acquisition/intake through the years. Employee prospects based upon average number of people to support X number of customers...
Ok, that's what I was hoping. That I merely took what you said out of context.
Honest to God, I've heard employers before talk about growth as more of a want. Hiring lots of employees because they (the employer) thought more staff could draw more customers. That was completely backwards thinking and cost them dearly.
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@ntoxicator said:
Big thanks for everyone with that insight.
Yeah - i've been here 8 years and have seen alot of growth. Although, unfortunately, treats it as a smaller business than what it should be. I try to keep a close relationship with CEO as when the company was smaller.
They refuse to give IT a budget. I seen on paper they only gave IT a 5,000 budget for year of 2015. I questioned it, and said there were other needs. I said, our new computer purchases blew past that already.
CEO wants to grow company to 250 employee's by 2017. And 50-100 employee's year after. These are projections I've had. But I can see him wanting a more formal proposal and outline.
It looks like you have some solid numbers to base at least two years worth of growth on already, not even numbers you had to invent - ones they gave you.
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@Dashrender said:
@ntoxicator said:
@Dashrender said:
64 GB RAM - is that all? My little server has 64, my big one has 120 GB, and you can easily buy servers today that will hold 512 GB + RAM. As for your storage, well, yeah - you have a storage problem. You just need to solve it. You might need more storage than a single typical server chassis can handle (though you can buy HPE and Dell servers that hold something like 18 drives - so you'd need some pretty crazy storage before you'd climb over that and need to go to DAS or NAS or SAN)
@Dashrender : this was also an example. To be all honest, We would actually need over 128GB of ram, and of-course the storage size to suite our needs.
I considered a XenServer HA setup with a HA setup for Network SAN units. Other users on here have bashed me for this idea and suggested a setup similar to Scale Computing (Where storage is local to servers).
Sux if someone bashed you here on ML - we try to be better than that other forum. That said, talking frankly and asking you to think critically is something most push for here at ML, sadly this comes off as bashing. That said, yeah I know bashing does still actually happen here on ML.
Scale is definitely a good solution, but it's not for everyone. it's not cheap to get into, $25K to start. Another option would be StarWinds vSAN software with Hyper-V (starwinds is free for 2 nodes if you are in SpiceWorks) or DRBD with XenServer (software is all free).
Yup. We don't officially support free on Xen (demand is too low) but if you're somebody who's interested just drop me a line and we'll do a custom key for you.
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Keep in mind it's a CFO and CEO job to limit the spending of the company and keep profits up. It's your job to show how spending this money will provide good ROI. As I see it they are doing they're job. They should question your purchasing and you need to defend it and sell it better
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Understood. I know ROI and TCO.. I've explained this to the CEO and asked him numerous times what his expectations are. What are the costs of downtime to him and the company?
Again, posted over 7m gross in 2015.. for a company of over 100 employee's. I don't see how would be such an issue to investigate new purchases. Also considering the fact, building a new 112,000 square foot facility to be moved into end of 2017 - although i have my doubts on being that soon.
Anyways, besides the fact of original posting. Essentially, DFS will not work for us due to file locks. I'm waiting to see if we can purchase an intel atom D525 server for this satellite office, or even a super micro i3 server that will run 2008 R2.... only will have ~20 employee's there.
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@ntoxicator said:
Understood. I know ROI and TCO.. I've explained this to the CEO and asked him numerous times what his expectations are. What are the costs of downtime to him and the company?
Again, posted over 7m gross in 2015.. for a company of over 100 employee's. I don't see how would be such an issue to investigate new purchases. Also considering the fact, building a new 112,000 square foot facility to be moved into end of 2017 - although i have my doubts on being that soon.
Gross doesn't really mean much. That's not counting the companies expenses. 100 employees isn't very big. were in the realm of 35,000 employees (with 1.6 Billion in Net profit this quarter) . We still have to be able to defend why were buying stuff.
Have you given hard numbers? to what this costs the company to have an what impact not having it will do? What systems are you quoting them to meet the business need?
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@ntoxicator said:
Anyways, besides the fact of original posting. Essentially, DFS will not work for us due to file locks. I'm waiting to see if we can purchase an intel atom D525 server for this satellite office, or even a super micro i3 server that will run 2008 R2.... only will have ~20 employee's there.
a NAS would be a better option than an intel atom or core i3 running windows server..
Why would you be installing a new server as 2008 R2? that's quite old now.
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Satellite office will need AD authentication, as right now they're authenticating over site-to-site vpn tunnel and pulling data over tunnel.
File shares over tunnel.
Local server, the mindset was local authentication (Secondary Domain controller / AD slave), and that server have shares.
I'm not aware of being able to use a NAS with file structure and appropriate file folder permissions from windows server. Would have to create file share on the NAS, and attach as network drive to windows server, and then from there build file folder permissions and such
We do have MS Maps account and access to keys and server 2012. Personally i cannot stand 2012, but it does work... or I'm just naive and not skills? I have skills, but I have a personal passion hate for windows servers and the overly complex bullshit. I've managed linux servers and just grew up with linux; besides the point here.
I understand the business aspect of posting a net revenue of XX, but only having a gross of such due to overhead and employee payroll expense.....
I would have no problem presenting a plan outline and I will do it regardless, so they can see it on paper. Just for our company size/structure does not make since. As I have direct line of communicate to the CEO.
I've given hard numbers and even a minimal proposal from Scale computing; just so they could get a general idea of numbers. Also obtained server quotes on new hardware to compare against using a new setup on XenServer.
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@ntoxicator said:
I'm not aware of being able to use a NAS with file structure and appropriate file folder permissions from windows server. Would have to create file share on the NAS, and attach as network drive to windows server, and then from there build file folder permissions and such
If you're referring to NTFS permissions almost all NAS devices will support that as well as being AD joined. You don't need a windows server in front of a NAS.
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@Jason said:
@ntoxicator said:
I'm not aware of being able to use a NAS with file structure and appropriate file folder permissions from windows server. Would have to create file share on the NAS, and attach as network drive to windows server, and then from there build file folder permissions and such
If you're referring to NTFS permissions almost all NAS devices will support that as well as being AD joined. You don't need a windows server in front of a NAS.
Additionally, AD authentication traffic is minimal. Hell with Windows 10 it is now designed to go to Azure AD.
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the office setup, or satellite users will be there for about a year before moved to new building being built...
yes, I can probably use LDAP or a AD connector with the NAS... just want less shit to worry about or break/issues.
Authentication over VPN i know is fine... its the fact we do roaming profiles and folder redirection. Thats reason for my thought of having onsite windows server. Is this wrong of me to think in that mindset?
Ofcourse I can easily setup a simple NAS with RAID-1, and then create file shares off that. But the fact is we have GPO settings on the PDC that also can be pushed to these users
IE; pushing a new default printer for this new office location. Hell, I still need to create a new security group / organization to put new users in and build a policy off that.
The move to this temporary office was a last minute item; and a get it done quick aspect from decision makers. Employee's have been there for a week now.
also carrying VOIP traffic over vpn tunnel. normal stuff.
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@ntoxicator said:
the office setup, or satellite users will be there for about a year before moved to new building being built...
yes, I can probably use LDAP or a AD connector with the NAS... just want less shit to worry about or break/issues.
Authentication over VPN i know is fine... its the fact we do roaming profiles and folder redirection. Thats reason for my thought of having onsite windows server. Is this wrong of me to think in that mindset?
Ofcourse I can easily setup a simple NAS with RAID-1, and then create file shares off that. But the fact is we have GPO settings on the PDC that also can be pushed to these users
IE; pushing a new default printer for this new office location. Hell, I still need to create a new security group / organization to put new users in and build a policy off that.
The move to this temporary office was a last minute item; and a get it done quick aspect from decision makers. Employee's have been there for a week now.
also carrying VOIP traffic over vpn tunnel. normal stuff.
You are wrong to want a server everywhere, yes.
Look at other methods to achieve it.
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Ok so explain this to me, as I'm obviously hitting a wall.
These were existing employee's at existing office, which now subside within the satellite office.
I would have to move their User folder file, and profile folder to a new network location.
Simply would I be able to attach this NAS network drive to the current PDC and then from there create a group policy for this new set of users which points to this new network file path? Then I can copy their user profile folders to this new network path.... keeping their existing user data and settings?
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@ntoxicator said:
Ok so explain this to me, as I'm obviously hitting a wall.
These were existing employee's at existing office, which now subside within the satellite office.
I would have to move their User folder file, and profile folder to a new network location.
Simply would I be able to attach this NAS network drive to the current PDC and then from there create a group policy for this new set of users which points to this new network file path? Then I can copy their user profile folders to this new network path.... keeping their existing user data and settings?
I've never seen redirected user folders work smoothly, but yes. That is basically it.
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So What is it that K12 environments use for user profiles and user data? Being that no user files are saved to workstations.
Is it my older teachings and methods to use Folder Redirection and roaming profiles? This is documented in 2008 R2 tech setups. I've used it on numerous setups and folder redirection has worked beautifully.
It would be a nightmare with employee turnover and the amount of times we shift employees around office to different desks to store data on individual machines.
I'm assuming look into a way of user home drives? I would think this would be messier approach?
You guys make me feel like a f[moderated]ing idiot at times.... simple direction is great or maybe some hand holding at times with my point of view and logic? Its like a pissing contest on here...
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@ntoxicator said:
You guys make me feel like a f[moderated]ing idiot at times.... simple direction is great or maybe some hand holding at times with my point of view and logic? Its like a pissing contest on here...
You asked for thoughts. I gave mine. if you don't want them, don't ask.
With that kind of reply it sounds like you only wanted someone to say what you already wanted to do. F[moderated] that.
Anyway, I stated that I have never seen user redirection work well. Period. I never said it cannot work or that it is not a viable solution. I know others that use it with no issues at all. @KyleCaminita for one. Still does not change my opinion on the subject.
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@ntoxicator said:
So What is it that K12 environments use for user profiles and user data? Being that no user files are saved to workstations.
They teach users to save to network drives, and they learn quickly else they lose data. Very few environments have a true need for roaming profiles and they usually suck anyway.
There's also cloud storage type options too own cloud, Pydio etc.
Your over complicating this. Just because someone is getting GPOs applied doesn't mean the server needs to be right there. It's Minimal traffic, and most of those things you mention like printers aren't going to be changing often, it will sync the GPO locally to the computer and apply it, it will only need to update if the GPO gets updated in the domain after that
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@ntoxicator said:
I've given hard numbers and even a minimal proposal from Scale computing; just so they could get a general idea of numbers. Also obtained server quotes on new hardware to compare against using a new setup on XenServer.
That's a bit over kill for a 20 user temp site even if you needed a server no reason for a scale system. If anything pick up something from xbyte or Dell outlet. But even that isn't really needed
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It's late, and I'm still not caught up here on ML.. I'll try to post a few suggestions tomorrow.
In the meantime, I just add that I too have been using folder redirection for My Documents since Windows 2000 - they work near flawlessly. I added redirecting Favorites about 2 years ago, again flawless.
I've done a few redirection of Desktop - that that's a whole other story and I've seen many problems with this, mainly because the desktop is not actually local anymore, it's remote on the server, sure it can be cached for offline use, but I have seen many problems with it, many centered around performance.
And roaming profiles - hot damn.. not if I can avoid. Those things corrupt all the time on me.. maybe it's my 100 Mb slow ass network causing that issue?
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@Dashrender said:
In the meantime, I just add that I too have been using folder redirection for My Documents since Windows 2000 - they work near flawlessly. I added redirecting Favorites about 2 years ago, again flawless.
Folder redirection works great. This main issues are
Sometimes software's hardcode the my documents folder to store data.
And Laptops, Offline Files can break.
