Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v



  • I setup a new server for a client two months ago. Hyper-V Server 2016 is installed and I have 2 Windows Server 2016 VMs.
    (Their software is not compatible with 2019 for some reason, hence the 2016 install) The client has been running their software for 2 months now and just decided that they want to use some fax feature their software offers. The fax feature requires running Windows Fax Server and having a specific $600+ pci fax card installed. I am trying to figure out the least painful route to make this work for them.

    The options I can think of are:

    1. Somehow passthrough the card to the VM from the host if possible.

    2. Or export the VMs, reinstall Windows Server 2016 on the host, add hyper-v role, add Windows Fax Server, import the VMs back. I feel like this is not allowed though because the host install can only have hyper-v role installed and nothing else.

    3. Or tell the client they need to purchase another Windows Server License and install on a basic desktop with the pci card added to it.

    Let me know what you guys think or if you have any other suggestions.

    Thanks



  • @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    The fax feature requires running Windows Fax Server and having a specific $600+ pci fax card installed.

    WTAF



  • Or #4, surprise them with the fact it is 2019 and they don't need fax 😉



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    The fax feature requires running Windows Fax Server and having a specific $600+ pci fax card installed.

    WTAF

    That was my response too. The fax cards, depending on number of lines/ports, range from $600-$4000.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Or #4, surprise them with the fact it is 2019 and they don't need fax 😉

    I have a ticket in with the software company to see if they have a efax option but I doubt it.



  • @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    The fax feature requires running Windows Fax Server and having a specific $600+ pci fax card installed.

    WTAF

    That was my response too. The fax cards, depending on number of lines/ports, range from $600-$4000.

    Feels like a hardware sales scheme.



  • Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.



  • @Pete-S said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.

    And you could potentially look at some kind of USB over IP solution to get the USB modem into the VM, no matter which server it's located on.



  • @dafyre said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Pete-S said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.

    And you could potentially look at some kind of USB over IP solution to get the USB modem into the VM, no matter which server it's located on.

    The software vendor specifically says they only support Mainpipe fax cards. There is some kind of add on software that Mainpipe includes that allows it to work properly with their software.



  • @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @dafyre said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Pete-S said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.

    And you could potentially look at some kind of USB over IP solution to get the USB modem into the VM, no matter which server it's located on.

    The software vendor specifically says they only support Mainpipe fax cards. There is some kind of add on software that Mainpipe includes that allows it to work properly with their software.

    picard_facepalm.jpg



  • @dafyre said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @syko24 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @dafyre said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Pete-S said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.

    And you could potentially look at some kind of USB over IP solution to get the USB modem into the VM, no matter which server it's located on.

    The software vendor specifically says they only support Mainpipe fax cards. There is some kind of add on software that Mainpipe includes that allows it to work properly with their software.

    picard_facepalm.jpg

    Don’t know if this is just marketing BS.
    http://www.mainpine.com/fax-service-provider-iqfsp.php

    I can probably get the $15 usb fax card. But then I run the risk of the vender telling me they don’t support that card and waste more of my time.



  • I'm sure I've done some sort of pass through with a graphics card.



  • I would contact the fax software guys and ask them if they support running under Hyper-V. Otherwise you could spend days trying to get things worked out and then perhaps it just doesn't work.

    PCI passthrough in Hyper-V looks like something that Microsoft doesn't support but is possible.

    Found this:
    https://devblogs.microsoft.com/scripting/passing-through-devices-to-hyper-v-vms-by-using-discrete-device-assignment/



  • @dafyre said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Pete-S said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Fax usually just needs a modem, which could be connected over serial or usb.

    If the software requires windows fax server then it will probably work with any type of fax device that windows supports.

    Something like this:
    https://www.usr.com/products/56k-dialup-modem/usr5637/

    Don't know what pass through options there are in Hyper-V so you have to check that.

    Anyway, fax communication protocols are old so it doesn't really requires anything special in the form of hardware.
    Looking at amazon I see USB modems from like $15 or so.

    And you could potentially look at some kind of USB over IP solution to get the USB modem into the VM, no matter which server it's located on.

    I do this for a HASP key, works perfectly!



  • Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.



  • @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.



  • @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    700 pages should be $42 on eFax with VoIP as a max. They figure $.015 - $.03 per page. But I was conservative and went with $.06. That's $42 for 700 pages. At the most liberal it would be $10.50.



  • @Dashrender Yeah I found a service, can't remember who that charges per minute instead of page. I think I posted about it here and even with your volume it was still way over what your POTS line cost.



  • We got a quote for $800 / mo. for 3,000 FAXes / mo. -- approx 9,000 pages / mo. A few POTS lines and an Intermec Multitech FAX server paid for that rather quickly.
    Sorry folks, but there are industries that will FAX no matter the opinion of others.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    700 pages should be $42 on eFax with VoIP as a max. They figure $.015 - $.03 per page. But I was conservative and went with $.06. That's $42 for 700 pages. At the most liberal it would be $10.50.

    huh? Are you talking about using your ATA and a VOIP carrier to send faxes? or a third part eFax solution? I've actually never priced any of the eFax solutions that plug directly into fax machines - perhaps they are at typical VOIP min rates...

    My pricing came from HIPAA complaint Fax solutions - that have web portals, etc.. they just charge you so damned much for that crap.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    700 pages should be $42 on eFax with VoIP as a max. They figure $.015 - $.03 per page. But I was conservative and went with $.06. That's $42 for 700 pages. At the most liberal it would be $10.50.

    700 pages a day (700 *.06 = $42 * 22 days = $942 a month)
    My POTS line costs me $35/m after taxes... heck, I can't even get one day's worth of faxes for that.



  • @scotth said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We got a quote for $800 / mo. for 3,000 FAXes / mo. -- approx 9,000 pages / mo. A few POTS lines and an Intermec Multitech FAX server paid for that rather quickly.
    Sorry folks, but there are industries that will FAX no matter the opinion of others.

    Exactly 700 pages/day * 22 days = 15,400 pages/month for me, looks like we were quoted from a similarly priced company.



  • @scotth said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We got a quote for $800 / mo. for 3,000 FAXes / mo. -- approx 9,000 pages / mo. A few POTS lines and an Intermec Multitech FAX server paid for that rather quickly.
    Sorry folks, but there are industries that will FAX no matter the opinion of others.

    Not a horrible price, but supposedly way, way higher than the voip.ms price. Which is like $200-$270 supposedly.



  • @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    Hyper-V as far as I know does not support PCI Pass-thru you need something like ESXi for that. As others have mention for faxing the best solution would be a serial modem and serial to IP converter.
    We use a Digi One SP connected to a Multitech serial modem (Don't remember the exact part#) that in turn is connected to a POTS phone line for the one application that still needs to fax out. The server run Digi's RealPort software to map a COM port to the device You could do this at scale if necessary using other type of network devices like IP to USB and usb modems.
    MultiTech spun off the FaxFinder series of fax servers which is what we used long ago but I never actually worked with it.
    I will be happy when the fax requirement goes away and can ditch the whole set up.
    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    700 pages should be $42 on eFax with VoIP as a max. They figure $.015 - $.03 per page. But I was conservative and went with $.06. That's $42 for 700 pages. At the most liberal it would be $10.50.

    huh? Are you talking about using your ATA and a VOIP carrier to send faxes? or a third part eFax solution? I've actually never priced any of the eFax solutions that plug directly into fax machines - perhaps they are at typical VOIP min rates...

    My pricing came from HIPAA complaint Fax solutions - that have web portals, etc.. they just charge you so damned much for that crap.

    It's their specific faxing rate. It's not an eFax solution, it's just a fax line from voip.ms. Fax lines require more technically handling to be reliable, so it costs more than a normal phone call.



  • @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    You said 700 pages a month before.



  • @Dashrender you are faxing 15,400 pages a month? Can a POTS line even handle that much during the working hours of a month?



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @scotth said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We got a quote for $800 / mo. for 3,000 FAXes / mo. -- approx 9,000 pages / mo. A few POTS lines and an Intermec Multitech FAX server paid for that rather quickly.
    Sorry folks, but there are industries that will FAX no matter the opinion of others.

    Not a horrible price, but supposedly way, way higher than the voip.ms price. Which is like $200-$270 supposedly.

    There's a huge difference here though Scott - with the VOIP.ms solution, YOU have to provide the ATA, the fax modem, the local storage, etc.

    With those online solutions, you just have, heck - your phone.



  • @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    Aww.. I missed that this was per month... the number was so low I just assumed it was a day.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    200? lol, and efaxing wasn't cost effective - try 700, efaxing was going to cost us like $1400/m compared to $60 for two POTS lines.... crazy.

    You said 700 pages a month before.

    yeah - you seeing that would make 700/m for $1400 would be insanely expensive...



  • @Dashrender said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    @jt1001001 said in Any way to pass through pci fax modem in hyper-v:

    We looked at e faxing solutions but it was not cost effective as we only pay I think $45/month for the line and LD and we fax close to 200 pages/month in some cases. Going to revisit one our fax needs reduce.

    Aww.. I missed that this was per month... the number was so low I just assumed it was a day.

    200 is way more likely to be a monthly figure, even for a decent sized company. For us 200 is like a "corporate lifetime" number, and it all happened in 1999-2001. LOL


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