file sharing in the 21st century



  • @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    Even with a few users with a lot of CAD files on their own individual computers, anyone touching another like file will cause problems. If they are all different, then all is well.

    You'll have to pick a person, have them sync their files to the NC server. Then the next person will try to sync to it, and if any of the files the second person tries to sync to it already exist, it won't handle it as expected.

    If everyone uses their own folder on the NC server, that would work better then.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    I would say re-evaluate this if you really are having this issue. UrBackup would be perfect for this. Setup the UrB server and then install the agents on each of the end points.

    From the Server specify what to backup from your user workstations (as you can get really granular) and it just backs up as changes are saved locally to the server.

    Problem solved and the capital spend is near zero.



  • @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    Even with a few users with a lot of CAD files on their own individual computers, anyone touching another like file will cause problems. If they are all different, then all is well.

    You'll have to pick a person, have them sync their files to the NC server. Then the next person will try to sync to it, and if any of the files the second person tries to sync to it already exist, it won't handle it as expected.

    If everyone uses their own folder on the NC server, that would work better then.

    That would work for the intermediate stages, but the final destination has to be a common repository.



  • @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    I have looked into those too, but they are not without their own similar problems, not to mention $30k+, plus more for yearly support.



  • @DustinB3403

    This is just one part of our overall issues. NC can't solve all the issues, nor could UrBackup or similar products.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @DustinB3403

    This is just one part of our overall issues. NC can't solve all the issues, nor could UrBackup or similar products.

    Sure, which is why you'll have to piece together a system that means your needs.

    How I'd imagine UrB would work for you is you use NC as a dumping ground. People pull only from it to their systems. They make the changes locally and save to a "Sync" folder on their systems. UrB backs up just this Sync folder to your NC installation.

    And the cycle repeats.



  • @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.



  • @travisdh1 said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.

    Yes, even modern tools like NextCloud are still "general purpose" storage, fundamentally flawed conceptually. Or you could think of NC as being specialized storage for LibreOffice and ONLYOFFICE, and then general for everything else. Just like SMB, it's general and only really well suited to its specific use cases.

    The real key to modern storage is using specialized storage per application. General storage is really only a dumping ground for what doesn't fit elsewhere.

    Compare it to a book shelf at home. It's meant for books or DVDs. Can you put a pile of paperwork there? Sure, but it doesn't work well. General storage is like a box you just toss things into that don't go anywhere else. It works, it holds them, but it doesn't organize or make good use of it.

    We all need that box (or kitchen drawer) to hold the random crap that fits nowhere else, that's critical. But you get best results at home or in your IT if you have the unique storage for unique needs.



  • @travisdh1 said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.

    The "Proper tools" still wont work for us



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @travisdh1 said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.

    The "Proper tools" still wont work for us

    That means that the CAD application doesn't work. At that point, it kind of becomes a combination of the app and use case's fault ๐Ÿ™‚

    If the proper tools can't do it, you can be pretty sure that general purpose ones aren't going to improve on that.



  • @scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @travisdh1 said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.

    The "Proper tools" still wont work for us

    That means that the CAD application doesn't work. At that point, it kind of becomes a combination of the app and use case's fault ๐Ÿ™‚

    If the proper tools can't do it, you can be pretty sure that general purpose ones aren't going to improve on that.

    We can make improvements, but nothing is going to fit us like a glove. I accept that.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @travisdh1 said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @coliver said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Obsolesce said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    CAD files

    You don't want to sync this stuff. It's bad for this type.

    We have the same thing here, and have tried some things in testing. Large drawings pulling sometimes hundreds or thousands of other drawings to make it. It needs to be on-prem, and should not be synchronized with anything. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen. NC/OneDrive/etc... that type of thing is NOT for this type of files.

    the problem we currently have is that these files are all sitting on local machines only, until the project is finished and it is loaded onto the server. Network performance even on 1gbps just can't cut it. Plus, I am not and have no plans to do any backups of individual workstations, the plan is to get it all on the server somehow. My NC is on prem though, at least for one of my locations.

    What CAD suite are you using? Time to start looking at their native server system. Dessault and Autodesk both have something to manage this. It isn't inexpensive but would be better then just SMB.

    Yes, exactly. CAD programs all have a proper tool to manage this stuff, use the native one.

    The "Proper tools" still wont work for us

    Then they need to find a different CAD application, or get management to do their jobs and make the people do the job. I'd expect any user doing CAD drawings to know about checking files in and out. No technological solution exists that can help with that.



  • There is a LOT more to a CAD system then just check in and check out. It's the other bits that don't work well for us.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    There is a LOT more to a CAD system then just check in and check out. It's the other bits that don't work well for us.

    Yes, but in theory, enough parts should work to make it good ๐Ÿ™‚



  • @scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    There is a LOT more to a CAD system then just check in and check out. It's the other bits that don't work well for us.

    Yes, but in theory, enough $$$ should work to make it good ๐Ÿ™‚

    FIFY



  • @scottalanmiller said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    There is a LOT more to a CAD system then just check in and check out. It's the other bits that don't work well for us.

    Yes, but in theory, enough parts should work to make it good ๐Ÿ™‚

    Yes. This sounds like you were trying to make your company a snowflake and you were the only people that ever do this. Youโ€™re using a fucking cad program FFS. itโ€™s normal use the tools like theyโ€™re meant to be used.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    would sharepoint be any better from this standpoint?

    LOL, no. All the same caveats, and loads more. Like cost, complexity, etc.



  • yeah, it might be back to the drawing board for me. I will really think about separating our the storage, based on purpose.

    On a side note, I am going to be spinning up a NC for personal use at home, it will work great for me in that regard.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    yeah, it might be back to the drawing board for me. I will really think about separating our the storage, based on purpose.

    That's generally what we do. NC is just for the office docs, live notes, and the "dumping ground" for other stuff. It's perfect for the tasks it is meant for, even live editing built in (more or less). And it is about the best "dumping ground" place for everything else.

    But for special things, you want a custom app and database (which might just be a file system) to handle the unique needs.

    This "dumping ground" thing applies to file systems, too. Most filesystems, especially the ones that we know commonly, are exactly that... just places to dump whatever. They aren't specialized and hence they come with loads of limitations. Anything that dumps to a filesystem whether it be DropBox, SMB, NC, NFS, you name it... has the limitation of the general purpose "dumping ground" at the end of the day.



  • Why do you want to move away from your Windows Server so badly? You don't mention anything (that I can see), other than broadening your horizons. It's probably the best bet for your CAD files.



  • @bnrstnr said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    Why do you want to move away from your Windows Server so badly? You don't mention anything (that I can see), other than broadening your horizons. It's probably the best bet for your CAD files.

    a list of benefits that we would get from something like NC:

    • no MS licensing dependencies
    • good remote access
    • versioning
    • the ability to share with outside parties or have them upload to us
    • better searching
    • tags

    There is probably more I forgot.



  • @Donahue said in file sharing in the 21st century:

    There is a LOT more to a CAD system then just check in and check out. It's the other bits that don't work well for us.

    So you're a snowflake company that the specializes tools, that do way more then just check in and check out, won't work for?

    Sounds like you have a bad implementation to me. I've been part of this battle before with engineers. Get one of the savvy ones on board and the rest will follow.


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