Security Updates Not Listening to Times.



  • @Dashrender said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    And Windows updates strike again.
    Ran windows updates on 11/2/2018 - at 5:36 PM causing the system to lock up again, easily resolved by restarting the front Point of Sale.
    I finally have just changed the setting to "Check for Updates, but allow me to choose when to download and install" to see if that resolves the issue.

    I have to assume theses are Windows Pro machines then for you to have this option. I think these machines will still auto install updates every 90'ish days or so.

    Waiting for you to push the button to update might sound good, but ultimately it just means more work for you with less actual benefit, unless your company is actually sandbox testing all of the updates for issues before you deploy them.
    Sadly, it's a double edged sword problem.

    From checking the " View Update History" it's checking and installing updates every day-2 days. Even after I set it to check once a week.
    This is a Windows 7 Machine.
    However I dont know what else to try here to help them, We've replaced the 8-port switch that runs the point of sale, Swapped Point of Sale Terminals, and this.

    What is the actual problem?

    The actual problem is the point of sale system locks up at random times/multiple times a day , After trouble shooting for a week now:

    At first I thought it was a switch issue - The switch was about 8-9 years old. Swapped that.
    Still locked up everyday, sometimes multiple times a day.
    Then I thought it was because of the "master" terminal going down, So we swapped that terminal.

    Still locked up that day about 4 hours after the swap.

    So I started looking at the PC in the back and One thing I checked was the windows updates, with the owner on the phone, I went through the times and dates with him that the system ran updates- and he noticed that the days and times i was saying was what he had documented for times it would lock up.

    So I changed the settings and it went away for a couple days, then on the 2nd it started again.

    Well if it's rebooting - that could explain it. Are the updates being successful? If so, I can't believe there are that many updates that close together.

    Updates are successful - but the PC does reboot. Says "you will need to reboot this PC" in the View update details.

    So it does the update - and reboots - yet still says it needs to reboot? Something is wrong. Sounds like the 'server' needs a rebuild.

    Sorry - the PC does not reboot - Then tells him needs to be rebooted.



  • @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    It could be a false positive hitting it. See if you can whitelist the directories for your app so Security Essentials ignores it.

    Okay, That sounds great. But im a Noob how do you do that?

    Open Control Panel > Windows Defender (if not there, then upgrade and install it) >Options > Exclude files and folders

    0_1541539141103_william.png



  • Boy, if it's not rebooting - then I doubt it's the updates unless the software is soooo crappy as to have issues from an update caused by waiting for the reboot.

    Just sounds like a flaky machine - time for a rebuild.



  • Okay, This is odd - Why are there so many updates? On my Work PC im Running Windows 7 - and I have just as many updates as the Customer who keeps calling in about the system lock- up .
    0_1541524258723_Windows updatesPersonal.PNG

    Picture for reference - Is this normal practice for Win 7?



  • Anyway - Update on the call for anyone who is interested :

    Called the customer to follow up; unchecked the "Allow all users to install updates" and set it to Download but do not install. No lock ups last night, My thought is - It was a different "Inactive" user on the PC that had the settings to install updates after work hours ( basic work hours being 9-5) causing system to lock up from the security-update installs.



  • Those are updates - but they are virus definition updates... not Windows updates.



  • Security Essentials is the free AV that came with Windows 7. If you aren't running another AV on that machine - you absolutely want these updates to run!



  • @Dashrender said in Window Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    Security Essentials is the free AV that came with Windows 7. If you aren't running another AV on that machine - you absolutely want these updates to run!

    I understand that, Now my question is Why do I have 6 Open Tickets all reporting the same issue as the other site : and when I look through the Update History I see the same thing - same time these run, the system locks up and slows down, Has to be restarted then It works fine.
    Everyday, same time, same issue now with 6 different sites - It's hard to believe that all 6 of these sites (that we installed with in the last 3 years from my understanding) will all have bad hardware What has worked so far is setting the Updates to download and making the site to install them everyday manually - For right now because Every other setting I have tried doesn't work, and still installs these security updates at the same time everyday.



  • It could be a false positive hitting it. See if you can whitelist the directories for your app so Security Essentials ignores it.



  • @Dashrender said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    It could be a false positive hitting it. See if you can whitelist the directories for your app so Security Essentials ignores it.

    Okay, That sounds great. But im a Noob how do you do that?



  • @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    It could be a false positive hitting it. See if you can whitelist the directories for your app so Security Essentials ignores it.

    Okay, That sounds great. But im a Noob how do you do that?

    Open Control Panel > Windows Defender (if not there, then upgrade and install it) >Options > Exclude files and folders

    0_1541539141103_william.png



  • @Dashrender said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Dashrender said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    It could be a false positive hitting it. See if you can whitelist the directories for your app so Security Essentials ignores it.

    Okay, That sounds great. But im a Noob how do you do that?

    Open Control Panel > Windows Defender (if not there, then upgrade and install it) >Options > Exclude files and folders

    0_1541539141103_william.png

    This site is using Microsoft Security Essentials - I was able to figure it out and got it excluded for our App - Going to test for the week and see where we go from there, Thanks Dash



  • Excluding our Application Directory from Microsoft Security Essentials seemed to have resolved this issue.



  • @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?



  • @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.



  • @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.

    I don't see the correlation. How is excluding a directory from updates even a thing? I can see excluding a directory from a scan, but MSE doesn't get updates based on directories.



  • @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.

    I don't see the correlation. How is excluding a directory from updates even a thing? I can see excluding a directory from a scan, but MSE doesn't get updates based on directories.

    This is what I know : okay? Stay with me here;

    My terminals on the front of house were locking up every time a Security Update came through on my Back office PC. Causing the Site to have to restart the terminals manually every time at the same time, Daily.

    After excluding the Directory for my application, I haven't had an issue in 3 days, and counting at multiple of my Windows 7 Sites.

    Could it be that the updates were spinning up more RAM to install these updates?

    Could it be that The System was False Positive hitting as @Dashrender suggested?



  • @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.

    I don't see the correlation. How is excluding a directory from updates even a thing? I can see excluding a directory from a scan, but MSE doesn't get updates based on directories.

    This is what I know : okay? Stay with me here;

    My terminals on the front of house were locking up every time a Security Update came through on my Back office PC. Causing the Site to have to restart the terminals manually every time at the same time, Daily.

    After excluding the Directory for my application, I haven't had an issue in 3 days, and counting at multiple of my Windows 7 Sites.

    Could it be that the updates were spinning up more RAM to install these updates?

    Could it be that The System was False Positive hitting as @Dashrender suggested?

    I wonder if it wasn't also running a scan at the same time using the newly installed updates? That is the only thing that makes sense. I wont argue with the results, I was just not satisfied with the explanation, because I couldn't follow the logic.



  • @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.

    I don't see the correlation. How is excluding a directory from updates even a thing? I can see excluding a directory from a scan, but MSE doesn't get updates based on directories.

    This is what I know : okay? Stay with me here;

    My terminals on the front of house were locking up every time a Security Update came through on my Back office PC. Causing the Site to have to restart the terminals manually every time at the same time, Daily.

    After excluding the Directory for my application, I haven't had an issue in 3 days, and counting at multiple of my Windows 7 Sites.

    Could it be that the updates were spinning up more RAM to install these updates?

    Could it be that The System was False Positive hitting as @Dashrender suggested?

    I wonder if it wasn't also running a scan at the same time using the newly installed updates? That is the only thing that makes sense. I wont argue with the results, I was just not satisfied with the explanation, because I couldn't follow the logic.

    That's understandable, I didn't even think of that as a possibility.



  • you can look at the event viewer and see when the security definitions were updated, and when scans are initiated.

    "you can view Windows Defender "Operational" events in Event Viewer
    Click your Start Button, type event viewer and hit Enter
    Look under: Applications and Services Logs - Microsoft - Windows - Windows Defender."

    FYI, on my W10 workstation, updates do not trigger an automatic scan, at least not with my current settings which are all on default AFAIK



  • @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    FYI, on my W10 workstation, updates do not trigger an automatic scan, at least not with my current settings which are all on default AFAIK

    Right - and I wouldn't expect them to kick off a scan on Windows 7 either (what WrCombs is running).

    But @WrCombs checking those logs to see if a scan is actually running is a great idea.



  • @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @Donahue said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    @WrCombs said in Security Updates Not Listening to Times.:

    5:30-6:00 pm and he manually restarts everything and then everything works fine.
    Right now I

    So for us following along at home, what was the actual problem and what was the fix? It looks like you were saying that the MSE updates were running at 5:30 or whenever, but was it actually trying to run a scan at that time? Was that the actual cause of the slowdowns?

    The problem was that MSE was installing updates daily at 5-5:30 causing the Point of Sale that runs off of that PC to freeze and lock up until they were restarted.
    The fix?
    I excluded our application directory from MSE updates and havent had a problem in 3 days.
    I have checked and the updates are still coming in , but no system lock ups.

    I don't see the correlation. How is excluding a directory from updates even a thing? I can see excluding a directory from a scan, but MSE doesn't get updates based on directories.

    This is what I know : okay? Stay with me here;

    My terminals on the front of house were locking up every time a Security Update came through on my Back office PC. Causing the Site to have to restart the terminals manually every time at the same time, Daily.

    After excluding the Directory for my application, I haven't had an issue in 3 days, and counting at multiple of my Windows 7 Sites.

    Could it be that the updates were spinning up more RAM to install these updates?

    Could it be that The System was False Positive hitting as @Dashrender suggested?

    I wonder if it wasn't also running a scan at the same time using the newly installed updates? That is the only thing that makes sense. I wont argue with the results, I was just not satisfied with the explanation, because I couldn't follow the logic.

    I tend to agree that a scan must be happening - otherwise updates alone shouldn't affect the operation of the PC.