MS Licensing - 3rd
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
No other VMs can exist on the machine on which Windows 7 is a VM.
This is not true from what I understand, if you have SA you're able to install up to 4 VMs (I think?) on one computer
SA is what allows that, not the Windows 7 licensing.
SA for Windows 10, not SA for Windows 7.
Isn't SA SA. If you have a valid SA today on your OEM Windows 7 licenses you can use Windows 10 on that machine... then using the SA rights you can downgrade to Windows 7 and get the 4 VMs rights of SA.
If you don't agree, please let us know why.
I'm not aware of anything like that and if you feel that SA rights provide alteration rights like that, you will have the reference for that. I don't agree because it seems unlikely, given you'd have to have something that stated it explicitely Do you have not? If not, that's the "why" I think it doesn't apply.
Downgrade rights are not related to "applying modern rights to old systems". That yo uhave downgrade implies nothing like you are saying. That doesn't mean that you are wrong, but if you are right, it is not coming from what you are saying.
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@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
That's not really telling, though. Everyone complains that the auditors know less than anyone. That they thought it was okay is so disconnected from the licensing that it really tells us nothing.
Totally agree with this. Same concept applies to many scenarios in life... Calling customer support? Call until you get someone to do what you want.
Though, I'm fairly confident, in this case, that it's true. I researched this a LOT before we bought SA for our programming guys that needed to run multiple VMs for different software.
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None of this really helps the OP, because SA does not get you Remote Access rights at all... and I'm sure there are rules that make it very clear that you cant skip server OSes just because you have SA and RDS CALs
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@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
None of this really helps the OP, because SA does not get you Remote Access rights at all... and I'm sure there are rules that make it very clear that you cant skip server OSes just because you have SA and RDS CALs
Actualy it does, remote access rights are one of hte largest features of SA.
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@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
None of this really helps the OP, because SA does not get you Remote Access rights at all... and I'm sure there are rules that make it very clear that you cant skip server OSes just because you have SA and RDS CALs
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
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@scottalanmiller Ah, I just assumed it didn't, we weren't getting SA for remote access reasons so I didn't really read into that portion of it.
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server license
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
None of this really helps the OP, because SA does not get you Remote Access rights at all... and I'm sure there are rules that make it very clear that you cant skip server OSes just because you have SA and RDS CALs
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
RDS can never apply to a desktop, only to a server. There is conceptually no such thing as an RDS for a desktop, not sure what you are picturing.
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@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server OS license
If you get some form of VDI icensing, you can skip server licensing. No server licensing is needed for VDI. Server licensing is just generally cheaper thatn VDI.
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@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server license
Correct, you wouldn't need a Windows Server license if you are running your app inside Windows 10 VMs using SA RDS CALs.
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@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server OS license
If you get some form of VDI icensing, you can skip server licensing. No server licensing is needed for VDI. Server licensing is just generally cheaper thatn VDI.
Now this I don't get.
A Window Server license is $800, that gives you two user's worth. SA for a machine in your environment (assuming you qualify) is $125 for 2 years per machine. And RDS license is like $50/user. It's going to take several years to climb over the $800 cost.
So what am I missing?
Of course, if you're user count is high, Datacenter licensing on Windows Sever will likely be the least expensive option.
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server license
Correct, you wouldn't need a Windows Server license if you are running your app inside Windows 10 VMs using SA RDS CALs.
Except no such thing exists, so obviously that isn't possible.
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server OS license
If you get some form of VDI icensing, you can skip server licensing. No server licensing is needed for VDI. Server licensing is just generally cheaper thatn VDI.
Now this I don't get.
A Window Server license is $800, that gives you two user's worth. SA for a machine in your environment (assuming you qualify) is $125 for 2 years per machine. And RDS license is like $50/user. It's going to take several years to climb over the $800 cost.
So what am I missing?
Of course, if you're user count is high, Datacenter licensing on Windows Sever will likely be the least expensive option.
Windows Server comes out to under $400/user for an OS generation.
SA comes out to $300/user every for years.So that is if you are not doing RDS. That's VDI using Windows Server to alter the licensing scheme.
RDS requires only a single server, for all your users. So gets really cheap, really quickly.
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LEt's do four years.
VDI for 10 users: $2,500
RDS for 10 users: $800 for server, $500 for CALs... Total is $1,300RDS is way cheper. Plus with the RDS way, you have another Windows server VM that you can use as you only consumed one of the two.
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Even if we lowered that to just five users...
VDI: $1,250
RDS: $1,050 -
And at four users:
VDI: $1,000
RDS: $1,000That is your inflection point if you have to pay $800 for Windows Server. The cost is the same, but the RDS gives you more power, plus the space Server VM license to use.
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@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server license
Correct, you wouldn't need a Windows Server license if you are running your app inside Windows 10 VMs using SA, AND RDS CALs.
Except no such thing exists, so obviously that isn't possible.
whoops missed punctuation
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@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server OS license
If you get some form of VDI icensing, you can skip server licensing. No server licensing is needed for VDI. Server licensing is just generally cheaper thatn VDI.
Now this I don't get.
A Window Server license is $800, that gives you two user's worth. SA for a machine in your environment (assuming you qualify) is $125 for 2 years per machine. And RDS license is like $50/user. It's going to take several years to climb over the $800 cost.
So what am I missing?
Of course, if you're user count is high, Datacenter licensing on Windows Sever will likely be the least expensive option.
Windows Server comes out to under $400/user for an OS generation.
SA comes out to $300/user every for years.So that is if you are not doing RDS. That's VDI using Windows Server to alter the licensing scheme.
RDS requires only a single server, for all your users. So gets really cheap, really quickly.
Where did RDS come into this? - OH I see - I meant the RDP license for remote access - but now I'm thinking you said that the RDP license is included with SA... so we can remove that from my price list.
And you're right, RDS vs VDI, RDS is way cheaper.
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@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@scottalanmiller said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@bnrstnr said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
@dashrender said in MS Licensing - 3rd:
What do you mean skip server OSes? SA and RDS CALs in this case would only be applying to the desktop OS, not the server.
I meant it as deploying the W10 would be skipping the purchase of another server OS license
If you get some form of VDI icensing, you can skip server licensing. No server licensing is needed for VDI. Server licensing is just generally cheaper thatn VDI.
Now this I don't get.
A Window Server license is $800, that gives you two user's worth. SA for a machine in your environment (assuming you qualify) is $125 for 2 years per machine. And RDS license is like $50/user. It's going to take several years to climb over the $800 cost.
So what am I missing?
Of course, if you're user count is high, Datacenter licensing on Windows Sever will likely be the least expensive option.
Windows Server comes out to under $400/user for an OS generation.
SA comes out to $300/user every for years.So that is if you are not doing RDS. That's VDI using Windows Server to alter the licensing scheme.
RDS requires only a single server, for all your users. So gets really cheap, really quickly.
Where did RDS come into this? - OH I see - I meant the RDP license for remote access - but now I'm thinking you said that the RDP license is included with SA... so we can remove that from my price list.
And you're right, RDS vs VDI, RDS is way cheaper.
RDP is a protocol and has no license.
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All of those VDI prices are sans infrasctructure, just doing ad hoc VMs without any golden image, no VDI management. None of hte stuff that people associate with VDI and feel make it cool. No VMware Horizons, no XenDesktop, just VM that you have to RDP into individually just as if they were individual desktops. Boring.
To do anything interesting wit them, you need lots of expensive software that would throw the equations way off. The RDS approach includes the cool stuff to make it awesome in that price.
For example, Microsoft's own VDI system leverages... RDS to do it. So you take all the cost of VDI plus all of the cost of RDS and merge them for Microsoft's "VDI solution" price.
