Hypervisor choice
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@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@DustinB3403 I started with the appliance, but have since installed the community version in my homelab. If I settle on XS / XO for the clubs, I'm going to make a budget request for the XO Starter Edition because I'd like to support the project.
How much is the 5Nine's support renewal compared to the $700/yr price for XOA?
$749 /year
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
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This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
See my comment above about loss of trust. What about next year when it becomes $5000 / year and this year's license expires leaving zero functionality? I'm out.
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@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 Until 5nine decides to change the licensing model again. They completely lost my trust with the latest change - I assumed I would at least have the free version features if they increased the price yet again. They have moved full version pricing from <$100 to $350/core to $700 enterprise and killed the free version in the span of a few years.
If XO were to fork a closed source branch, we would at least have full source for the current version.I spoke to someone claiming to be a VP and I told him that this decision is ultimately going to lose them customers. No one is going to pay what they are asking. I'd rather switching hypervisors
5Nines probably doesn't care. Those low end customers weren't paying the bills, so they dumped them.
How many future purchases will that kind of mindset cost them?
Again, probably not many that they care about. This is the same mindset that XOA is in. They don't want the low end SMB, because supporting those people costs them money, not making them money.
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This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
Also, note that I said I would put in a budget request. If they can't afford the Starter Edition, I'll make do with the limitations of the free edition. I just lost that ability with 5nine.
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
Also, note that I said I would put in a budget request. If they can't afford the Starter Edition, I'll make do with the limitations of the free edition. I just lost that ability with 5nine.
The free edition is unlimited (besides XOSAN (HA) solution). It literally does all of it.
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
Also, note that I said I would put in a budget request. If they can't afford the Starter Edition, I'll make do with the limitations of the free edition. I just lost that ability with 5nine.
Stick with the free edition unless you need or want the additional features, then use the XO script that is provided here.
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@black3dynamite said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
Also, note that I said I would put in a budget request. If they can't afford the Starter Edition, I'll make do with the limitations of the free edition. I just lost that ability with 5nine.
Stick with the free edition unless you need or want the additional features, then use the XO script that is provided here.
The difference isn't free vs paid. It's Community Support vs Developer Support.
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@DustinB3403 So, no limitations on using the community edition in a business / non-profit environment? Other than risking possible build-it-yourself issues? I was assuming I should stick with the free XOA if they can't pony up.
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@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 Until 5nine decides to change the licensing model again. They completely lost my trust with the latest change - I assumed I would at least have the free version features if they increased the price yet again. They have moved full version pricing from <$100 to $350/core to $700 enterprise and killed the free version in the span of a few years.
If XO were to fork a closed source branch, we would at least have full source for the current version.I spoke to someone claiming to be a VP and I told him that this decision is ultimately going to lose them customers. No one is going to pay what they are asking. I'd rather switching hypervisors
Well, except were you going to pay before? If not, how is it losing them customers?
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@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 Until 5nine decides to change the licensing model again. They completely lost my trust with the latest change - I assumed I would at least have the free version features if they increased the price yet again. They have moved full version pricing from <$100 to $350/core to $700 enterprise and killed the free version in the span of a few years.
If XO were to fork a closed source branch, we would at least have full source for the current version.I spoke to someone claiming to be a VP and I told him that this decision is ultimately going to lose them customers. No one is going to pay what they are asking. I'd rather switching hypervisors
5Nines probably doesn't care. Those low end customers weren't paying the bills, so they dumped them.
Weren't paying at all. Not really customers, per se.
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@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 Until 5nine decides to change the licensing model again. They completely lost my trust with the latest change - I assumed I would at least have the free version features if they increased the price yet again. They have moved full version pricing from <$100 to $350/core to $700 enterprise and killed the free version in the span of a few years.
If XO were to fork a closed source branch, we would at least have full source for the current version.I spoke to someone claiming to be a VP and I told him that this decision is ultimately going to lose them customers. No one is going to pay what they are asking. I'd rather switching hypervisors
5Nines probably doesn't care. Those low end customers weren't paying the bills, so they dumped them.
How many future purchases will that kind of mindset cost them?
Very few, I would guess. They probably saw no conversion of people from free to paid accounts.
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
See my comment above about loss of trust. What about next year when it becomes $5000 / year and this year's license expires leaving zero functionality? I'm out.
I guess, but really this is just eliminating a free tier that was very limited. What happens in a year if they go to $5K? You switch then. If they don't (which is never going to happen) then you've lost nothing. The logic of that risk would keep you on it until they do something crazy.
They've not changed any pricing, they've only stopped offering a super limited, free version of the software. I wouldn't call that a lack of trust per se, what were we trusting them to do?
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@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@wirestyle22 Until 5nine decides to change the licensing model again. They completely lost my trust with the latest change - I assumed I would at least have the free version features if they increased the price yet again. They have moved full version pricing from <$100 to $350/core to $700 enterprise and killed the free version in the span of a few years.
If XO were to fork a closed source branch, we would at least have full source for the current version.I spoke to someone claiming to be a VP and I told him that this decision is ultimately going to lose them customers. No one is going to pay what they are asking. I'd rather switching hypervisors
5Nines probably doesn't care. Those low end customers weren't paying the bills, so they dumped them.
How many future purchases will that kind of mindset cost them?
Again, probably not many that they care about. This is the same mindset that XOA is in. They don't want the low end SMB, because supporting those people costs them money, not making them money.
Exactly, this is basically identical to XOA. But XO has the benefit of being open source so you know the free version will always exist.
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
Also, note that I said I would put in a budget request. If they can't afford the Starter Edition, I'll make do with the limitations of the free edition. I just lost that ability with 5nine.
Why the Starter Edition and not the fully open edition?
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
@DustinB3403 So, no limitations on using the community edition in a business / non-profit environment? Other than risking possible build-it-yourself issues? I was assuming I should stick with the free XOA if they can't pony up.
It's open source, no limits whatsoever .
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
I was assuming I should stick with the free XOA if they can't pony up.
No, this is one of those weird business model problems that we complain about with XO.... the totally free community edition is really better than XOA.
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@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
esxi is out because of the expense and their inability to provide a fully functional Web client to replace the thick client they've killed off.Quick thing. ESXi has a free HTML5 interface (It's what replaced the thick client). When combined with VMware Remote Console (VMRC) for managing console sessions it's pretty damn poweful.
STILL, want a full thick GUI? Fusion/Workstation will do it and manage hosts.
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@scottalanmiller said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
See my comment above about loss of trust. What about next year when it becomes $5000 / year and this year's license expires leaving zero functionality? I'm out.
I guess, but really this is just eliminating a free tier that was very limited. What happens in a year if they go to $5K? You switch then. If they don't (which is never going to happen) then you've lost nothing. The logic of that risk would keep you on it until they do something crazy.
They've not changed any pricing, they've only stopped offering a super limited, free version of the software. I wouldn't call that a lack of trust per se, what were we trusting them to do?
This isn't a situation like LogMeIn where they put in black and white that they would never kill their free service, then a year later did exactly that. Now those people you can't trust.
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@Dashrender said in Hypervisor choice:
@scottalanmiller said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
This seems like a small amount compared to switching the whole platform. Plus I thought they had no budget for the renewal? But now they can come up with $700 less?
See my comment above about loss of trust. What about next year when it becomes $5000 / year and this year's license expires leaving zero functionality? I'm out.
I guess, but really this is just eliminating a free tier that was very limited. What happens in a year if they go to $5K? You switch then. If they don't (which is never going to happen) then you've lost nothing. The logic of that risk would keep you on it until they do something crazy.
They've not changed any pricing, they've only stopped offering a super limited, free version of the software. I wouldn't call that a lack of trust per se, what were we trusting them to do?
This isn't a situation like LogMeIn where they put in black and white that they would never kill their free service, then a year later did exactly that. Now those people you can't trust.
Good point. That was "free forever" and it got taken away. With 5Nine, existing customers are STILL free, it's only new ones that can't get it. Anyone who WAS a customer of it still has it. So there is no one that had things change on them. LogMeIn screwed existing customers.
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@John-Nicholson said in Hypervisor choice:
@jfath said in Hypervisor choice:
esxi is out because of the expense and their inability to provide a fully functional Web client to replace the thick client they've killed off.Quick thing. ESXi has a free HTML5 interface (It's what replaced the thick client). When combined with VMware Remote Console (VMRC) for managing console sessions it's pretty damn poweful.
STILL, want a full thick GUI? Fusion/Workstation will do it and manage hosts.
Right - if the OP is willing to go to bat for a $700 XOA license, why not a $500/600 ESXi essentials license? or a $750 5Nines license?
