Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage



  • This is the first hit for Birthday when searching ML.



  • @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    This is the first hit for Birthday when searching ML.

    Imagine how far down an unordered tag list it would be to find what you wanted!

    @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    This is the first hit for Birthday when searching ML.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Birthday Today:

    @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    This is the first hit for Birthday when searching ML.

    Imagine how far down an unordered tag list it would be to find what you wanted!

    @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    This is the first hit for Birthday when searching ML.

    If your post had been tagged, I would have found it much faster and just used it. Instead I did actually search for birthday, and after the first two links were not what I wanted I gave up and made a new thread.

    Now if this was important, and I was searching on Google for something, I would click a heck of a lot more than 2 links before giving up.. but still, I think the tag would have at least narrowed me down to what I wanted better. But it's your thread, tag or don't.. it's fine.



  • @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    If your post had been tagged, I would have found it much faster and just used it. Instead I did actually search for birthday, and after the first two links were not what I wanted I gave up and made a new thread.

    This is incorrect and you just explained why. Had the birthday posts all had tags, this would have been even farther down on the list. And since you only take the first two options and give up instead of doing something simple like looking for the right title on the screen, tagging would have been even more useless to you.

    I'm unsure why you think having tags for birthday threads would make it easier to find. It simply would not based specifically around how you just take the top two results without further evaluating them. It could easily be the 100th down on the tag list. At least with title searching it is far more limited in results and that it is so active keeps it closer to the top.



  • @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    Now if this was important, and I was searching on Google for something, I would click a heck of a lot more than 2 links before giving up.. but still, I think the tag would have at least narrowed me down to what I wanted better. But it's your thread, tag or don't.. it's fine.

    Then you don't understand the tags, because that's simply untrue. I have no idea how you picture tags working, but it doesn't do what you think.



  • @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    but still, I think the tag would have at least narrowed me down to what I wanted better. But it's your thread, tag or don't.. it's fine.

    Then demonstrate it....

    Here is one I have to deal with all of the time, find the original SAM Linux Administration thread. You say tags are easier, show me how:

    https://mangolassi.it/tags/sam linux administration

    https://mangolassi.it/search?term=sam linux administration&in=titlesposts

    Tell me how using the tags gets to this result more easily:

    0_1487254052804_Screenshot from 2017-02-16 15-07-22.png



  • Just lock this thread too please 🙂



  • Now you can continue to post about tags, @Dashrender

    It's an important topic, IT works with tagging and metadata, taxonomy and folksonomy as critical parts of what we do, it's a super important part of IT and data management and figuring out how, when and why metadata is used is very important.

    So here are some examples:

    Why Starwind is a good tag Because the vendor and interested parties want to know when that topic comes up in conversation. People looking for historical discussions (not mentions, but discussions) about their products want to be able to filter them out. We want to be able to compare the volume of conversations against the volume of other conversations.

    Why birthday and community member's names are not good tags Because there is no one interested in tracking "conversations about birthdays." In fact, there was so much effort against this that a policy to use the birthday thread for normal birthdays (special cases apply, but specifically community member birthdays) would all be in one place. Because it's the only active birthday thread it is instantly found on the top few hits of a search so zero effort is needed going that path and/or it is in the top few of the popular threads. It's easy to find because it's the only one. A tag for a single item is a clutter for the tagging system and redundant as the title does that work already. Tagging a person is similarly pointless. There is already a mentions system for that, making tags of people's names doesn't track changing usernames, no one is looking for topics about people and people don't need to use tags to track themselves. It doesn't serve a purpose, it's just tagging to tag.

    Good tags are topical, specific enough to be useful without being ridiculous. Tags should be about the topic at hand in a descriptive way.

    For example, a thread about a Veeam backup might tag backup, veeam, the storage vendor, the veeam product used and other clearly relevant things to the conversation. Pretty much nothing in the water closet would use a tag.

    When thinking of tags and meta data ask - would we want this to be filtered into a group with other topics that would share this tag?

    Clearly with community member names or things like birthdays, the answer is no. No one will have a general interest or want to follow "all topics about birthdays." But they will want to follow "all topics about Windows 2016".



  • @Dashrender said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    Just lock this thread too please 🙂

    You haven't done my tag vs. search challenge yet. I want to know how you are using tags to get to get to a specific post faster!



  • @scottalanmiller said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    @Dashrender said in Birthday Today:

    but still, I think the tag would have at least narrowed me down to what I wanted better. But it's your thread, tag or don't.. it's fine.

    Then demonstrate it....

    Here is one I have to deal with all of the time, find the original SAM Linux Administration thread. You say tags are easier, show me how:

    https://mangolassi.it/tags/sam linux administration

    https://mangolassi.it/search?term=sam linux administration&in=titlesposts

    Tell me how using the tags gets to this result more easily:

    0_1487254052804_Screenshot from 2017-02-16 15-07-22.png

    This. Very much of this. Do the exact same thing with my free PBX guide.

    The fastest way to get to my index post is to search the tag, click any topic, zip to the bottom, and click the link back to the f***ing index.



  • @JaredBusch we need like a meta page of links to the heads of topics like that.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    @JaredBusch we need like a meta page of links to the heads of topics like that.

    This topic has no tags.



  • @scottalanmiller said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    Why birthday and community member's names are not good tags

    Clearly with community member names or things like birthdays, the answer is no. No one will have a general interest or want to follow "all topics about birthdays." But they will want to follow "all topics about Windows 2016".

    While I do agree with this, why does this exist? I did not make said topic.
    https://mangolassi.it/tags/jared busch



  • I use tags for browsing categories, and I use searches for finding something specific.

    When you go in to a library wanting a sci-fi book, you go to the sci-fi section, or even look for an aliens area (tags). And when you are looking for something specific, such as Terminator, you will search for it... or search more specifically (searches).

    That's how I use and think of tags, whether its right or wrong I don't care. It works well for me that way.

    May be a bad example I don't know, hopefully my point came across correctly.



  • @JaredBusch said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    @scottalanmiller said in Trying to Figure out Tags and Metadata Usage:

    Why birthday and community member's names are not good tags

    Clearly with community member names or things like birthdays, the answer is no. No one will have a general interest or want to follow "all topics about birthdays." But they will want to follow "all topics about Windows 2016".

    While I do agree with this, why does this exist? I did not make said topic.
    https://mangolassi.it/tags/jared busch

    It's a tag for speakers and content creators. e.g. if someone is looking for content by "Jared Busch" in the context of conference speaker, book writer or so forth - not as community member. If that makes sense.