Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Is everything going? We can be confident of that?
Yes, there is literally zero reason for the concern to have arisen. It's a false worry based on nothing, then weird doubt of injecting a weird "if we send all logs somewhere, how can we be sure it is ALL logs." Um... you sent them ALL, period. If you think that the most used syslog software in the world randomly doesn't send logs of its own accord just to trick you, you are either into a realm of not trusting the platform whatsoever and this discussion is moot, or you are going crazy and need a tinfoil hat.
What would make you even ask this question?
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@JaredBusch said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@Dashrender said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@DustinB3403 said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
What log server are you using to collect the logs?
What changes did you make to the config file for the logs?
I was using Graylog, which was working before. However now it is NOT working.
Trying to reinstall GrayLog.
I figured out why Graylog wasn't "working".
It installs with a timezone of straight UTC. I set my timezone to America/New_York and rebooted. And VOILA! It is now working again.
what about it wasn't working? your time based searches were off? or because the time zones didn't match, it didn't work?
I was searching for traffic from, say, the past 30 minutes, and nothing was showing up.
Which means nothing was ever "not working."
Instead you were searching incorrectly.Well, I did put "working" in quotes.
But I disagree I was searching incorrectly. If you want to play a word game, I would consider it correct searching of data that was incorrectly entered.
I don't think that that is possible. The issue was that you had the wrong time on the system, right? So the data was entered correctly, but searched for incorrectly. Isn't that what actually happened? UTC data is not going to cause a time problem, that's why we use it. The issue was that you had the wrong time on the box and then did a search in the future rather than for the current data?
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@DustinB3403 is still on XS 6.5, and he saw the same issues I did. When you comment out the local logging, XS just re-writes the file.
It does? It rewrites the xenserver.conf file?
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@scottalanmiller said
What would make you even ask this question?
Didn't you say the same thing about redirecting /var/log?
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@scottalanmiller said
I don't think that that is possible. The issue was that you had the wrong time on the system, right? So the data was entered correctly, but searched for incorrectly. Isn't that what actually happened? UTC data is not going to cause a time problem, that's why we use it. The issue was that you had the wrong time on the box and then did a search in the future rather than for the current data?
Again, if we want to play a semantics game of ... hey all the Linux gurus in the world use UTC, and if you don't, well you just don't know what you are doing, then fine, it was a searching error, and all mine. I'm not saying that isn't true.
But if I buy an alarm clock, I expect it to be in regular time, just like every other clock ever. Unless it is a special clock that clearly states UTC on the box.
Every system I have ever used always adjusts to local time. Even XS asks you that. All the Linux distros do as well.
If you are trying to tell me that this ONE system that is set up like this is the norm, and all the others are incorrect or just plain dumb, well, then, fine.
So, you are telling me on your desktop, the clock is UTC? Do you use UTC in your daily life?
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
So, you are telling me on your desktop, the clock is UTC? Do you use UTC in your daily life?
Yes, I sometimes even set my desktop to it and I have it on my watch. UTC is by far the most useful timezone and saves a lot of headaches.
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Again, if we want to play a semantics game of ... hey all the
LinuxIT gurus in the world use UTC, and if you don't, well you just don't know what you are doing, then fine, it was a searching error, and all mine. I'm not saying that isn't true.FTFY
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
But if I buy an alarm clock, I expect it to be in regular time, just like every other clock ever. Unless it is a special clock that clearly states UTC on the box.
I don't even understand this statement. UTC is regular time as much as anything else.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Is everything going? We can be confident of that?
Yes, there is literally zero reason for the concern to have arisen. It's a false worry based on nothing, then weird doubt of injecting a weird "if we send all logs somewhere, how can we be sure it is ALL logs." Um... you sent them ALL, period. If you think that the most used syslog software in the world randomly doesn't send logs of its own accord just to trick you, you are either into a realm of not trusting the platform whatsoever and this discussion is moot, or you are going crazy and need a tinfoil hat.
What would make you even ask this question?
what made me think of a question like that was the break out of all of the log information in the config file. But the . at the end does kind of imply that all things would go to the listed place.
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
If you are trying to tell me that this ONE system that is set up like this is the norm, and all the others are incorrect or just plain dumb, well, then, fine.
General good practice (rule of thumb, NOT best practice) is to "always" use UTC for all service based systems (servers and similar devices.) End users set time for the user, not the system, so this does not normally apply to end users. But we've always set all servers to UTC since the late 1990s. It protects against time bugs from the 1990s, it makes logs way clearer, it keeps people like @Minion-Queen from causing time problems from getting confused on time zones, it lets teams in different regions work together seamlessly. Yes, UTC on everything for IT.
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@Dashrender said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Is everything going? We can be confident of that?
Yes, there is literally zero reason for the concern to have arisen. It's a false worry based on nothing, then weird doubt of injecting a weird "if we send all logs somewhere, how can we be sure it is ALL logs." Um... you sent them ALL, period. If you think that the most used syslog software in the world randomly doesn't send logs of its own accord just to trick you, you are either into a realm of not trusting the platform whatsoever and this discussion is moot, or you are going crazy and need a tinfoil hat.
What would make you even ask this question?
what made me think of a question like that was the break out of all of the log information in the config file. But the . at the end does kind of imply that all things would go to the listed place.
But we stopped breaking out.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@DustinB3403 is still on XS 6.5, and he saw the same issues I did. When you comment out the local logging, XS just re-writes the file.
It does? It rewrites the xenserver.conf file?
Well, in 6.5 it is located at /etc/syslog.conf.
If you make changes to it, it gets re-written on service restart.
At least that is what I saw. And also what happened to @DustinB3403. And also people in the comments left that it had happened to them. (You could make it read only which stopped this.)
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Every system I have ever used always adjusts to local time. Even XS asks you that. All the Linux distros do as well.
No, every system adjusts to local time if you tell it to. Every system uses UTC too, if you tell it to.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
But if I buy an alarm clock, I expect it to be in regular time, just like every other clock ever. Unless it is a special clock that clearly states UTC on the box.
I don't even understand this statement. UTC is regular time as much as anything else.
I think he meant local time, not regular time.
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Well, in 6.5 it is located at /etc/syslog.conf.
You sure? That goes against what we had determined.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
If you are trying to tell me that this ONE system that is set up like this is the norm, and all the others are incorrect or just plain dumb, well, then, fine.
General good practice (rule of thumb, NOT best practice) is to "always" use UTC for all service based systems (servers and similar devices.) End users set time for the user, not the system, so this does not normally apply to end users. But we've always set all servers to UTC since the late 1990s. It protects against time bugs from the 1990s, it makes logs way clearer, it keeps people like @Minion-Queen from causing time problems from getting confused on time zones, it lets teams in different regions work together seamlessly. Yes, UTC on everything for IT.
Huh, first time I've ever heard this - even being in SW for better than 5 years.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Well, in 6.5 it is located at /etc/syslog.conf.
You sure? That goes against what we had determined.
Determined where? All we determined was that the article was from 6.2 and in 7 they changed everything.
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
It does? It rewrites the xenserver.conf file?
If you make changes to it, it gets re-written on service restart.
At least that is what I saw. And also what happened to @DustinB3403. And also people in the comments left that it had happened to them. (You could make it read only which stopped this.)
It should be what you saw since the documentation that you provided in that link stated that exactly this would happen on 6.5 if you used that file instead of the correct one.
Those people in the comments were just pointing out that you were using the wrong file (and they were too) and for some reason they suggested making it read only instead of suggesting editing the right file.
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@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Well, in 6.5 it is located at /etc/syslog.conf.
You sure? That goes against what we had determined.
Determined where? All we determined was that the article was from 6.2 and in 7 they changed everything.
No, we determined that it was 6.2 and that all evidence said that the change was in 6.5. We know 100% that things had changed by 7, and there is zero reason to not think that it changed in 6.5 and everything in that thread showed that it had indeed changed in 6.5.
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@scottalanmiller said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
@BRRABill said in Final Call ... XenServer Boot Media:
Well, in 6.5 it is located at /etc/syslog.conf.
You sure? That goes against what we had determined.
chuckle - well, here are more semantics. that is the location that the system reads, but as shown above, XS has a script that changes that file upon startup, so the real place you need to edit is the location listed previously.
