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    Looking For Alternate IT roles

    Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved IT Discussion
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    • RamblingBipedR
      RamblingBiped
      last edited by

      I would suspect you're writing software @Obsolesce . I am constantly engineering automation and tooling for facilitating the build, test, deployment, and reliabilty of software. Whether that is writing a Lambda, creating a Step Function State Machine, or rearchitecting an existing workload for the Cloud.

      It's all code, and it is all stored in a source repository, and developed using the same principles and engineering practice that would go into developing any other application/piece of software.

      IRJI ObsolesceO 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • ObsolesceO
        Obsolesce @RamblingBiped
        last edited by Obsolesce

        @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

        @Obsolesce If you're doing DevOps and you're not engineering software, aren't you just doing Ops then?

        Literally zero software engineering, zero software programming. I am currently spending a lot of time in Azure DevOps, as well as Azure Automation and other Azure serverless technologies.

        1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • IRJI
          IRJ
          last edited by

          A pure devops engineer job is infrastructure as code pretty much. It has nothing to do with developing software.

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • IRJI
            IRJ @RamblingBiped
            last edited by

            @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

            I would suspect you're writing software @Obsolesce . I am constantly engineering automation and tooling for facilitating the build, test, deployment, and reliabilty of software. Whether that is writing a Lambda, creating a Step Function State Machine, or rearchitecting an existing workload for the Cloud.

            It's all code, and it is all stored in a source repository, and developed using the same principles and engineering practice that would go into developing any other application/piece of software.

            Yeah thats not software, its called infrastructure as code.

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • IRJI
              IRJ
              last edited by

              Just because you use git doesnt make you a developer lol.

              RamblingBipedR 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • IRJI
                IRJ
                last edited by

                Companies may ask you to wear multiple hats, but everything else is outside the devops role.

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • ObsolesceO
                  Obsolesce @RamblingBiped
                  last edited by Obsolesce

                  @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                  I would suspect you're writing software @Obsolesce . I am constantly engineering automation and tooling for facilitating the build, test, deployment, and reliabilty of software. Whether that is writing a Lambda, creating a Step Function State Machine, or rearchitecting an existing workload for the Cloud.

                  It's all code, and it is all stored in a source repository, and developed using the same principles and engineering practice that would go into developing any other application/piece of software.

                  No, I'm not writing any software. I'm not writing any applications.

                  @Obsolesce said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                  @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                  @Obsolesce If you're doing DevOps and you're not engineering software, aren't you just doing Ops then?

                  edit:
                  Literally zero software engineering, zero software programming. I am currently spending a lot of time in Azure DevOps, as well as Azure Automation and other Azure serverless technologies. I really like Azure Functions a lot and have quite a bit in there. I started moving a lot of Azure Automation scripts to Functions with a lot of better than expected results.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • RamblingBipedR
                    RamblingBiped @IRJ
                    last edited by

                    @IRJ

                    So using python to architect and write a serverless application doesn't count as software engineering? Developing, testing, and deploying custom resources for CloudFormation doesn't count as Software Engineering?

                    ^That work literally follows the same steps and workflow as developing a microservice.

                    IRJI ObsolesceO 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • IRJI
                      IRJ @RamblingBiped
                      last edited by

                      @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                      @IRJ

                      So using python to architect and write a serverless application doesn't count as software engineering? Developing, testing, and deploying custom resources for CloudFormation doesn't count as Software Engineering?

                      ^That work literally follows the same steps and workflow as developing a microservice.

                      Nope

                      That is again infrastructure as code. Python is used by damn near every Linux admin

                      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • ObsolesceO
                        Obsolesce @RamblingBiped
                        last edited by

                        @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                        So using python to architect and write a serverless application

                        Define application?

                        RamblingBipedR 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • IRJI
                          IRJ
                          last edited by

                          Cloudformation is just a json files. Nearly every system admin deals with json files

                          ObsolesceO 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • ObsolesceO
                            Obsolesce @IRJ
                            last edited by

                            @IRJ said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                            Cloudformation is just a json files. Nearly every system admin deals with json files

                            ...not because we like json.

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                            • RamblingBipedR
                              RamblingBiped @Obsolesce
                              last edited by

                              @Obsolesce

                              One of the most recent examples was a python-based serverless application composed of multiple lambdas that interfaced with AWS Organizations to provide automation around creating, configuring, and deploying AWS accounts and automated governance. It is exposed to end users through a self-service portal as a Service Catalog Product.

                              All written in python, deployed and managed via SAM templates, and maintained via a CI/CD pipeline.

                              ObsolesceO 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • scottalanmillerS
                                scottalanmiller @IRJ
                                last edited by

                                @IRJ said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                                @scottalanmiller said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                                @IRJ said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                                DevOps = Cross between IT admin and Engineer. It is almost solely scripting and command line based, which makes it awesome IMO.

                                Yeah, DevOps makes it almost impossible to keep your hats separate because you kind of role the two together.

                                Also DevOps roles never deal with users. Some people may or may not like that

                                Not desktop users. But they will often deal with software dev users or other IT departments as users.

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • RamblingBipedR
                                  RamblingBiped
                                  last edited by

                                  And yes, CloudFormation is IAC via JSON or YAML templates. It does have more dynamic aspects that allow you to code logic into the provisioning of resources though.

                                  (Intrinsic Functions, Mappings, Conditions, Imports/Exports)

                                  IRJI 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • IRJI
                                    IRJ @RamblingBiped
                                    last edited by

                                    @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                                    And yes, CloudFormation is IAC via JSON or YAML templates. It does have more dynamic aspects that allow you to code logic into the provisioning of resources though.

                                    (Intrinsic Functions, Mappings, Conditions, Imports/Exports)

                                    Yeah I mean I use terraform and have used cloudformation as well. To me it's still all infrastructure as code

                                    RamblingBipedR 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • RamblingBipedR
                                      RamblingBiped
                                      last edited by

                                      And developing a Custom Resource for Cloudformation usually involves Software Engineering, as it is either backed by a Lambda function, Application, or considerably complex architectures triggered via SNS.

                                      IRJI 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • IRJI
                                        IRJ @RamblingBiped
                                        last edited by

                                        @RamblingBiped said in Looking For Alternate IT roles:

                                        And developing a Custom Resource for Cloudformation usually involves Software Engineering, as it is either backed by a Lambda function, Application, or considerably complex architectures triggered via SNS.

                                        Microsoft has a good definition of IaC and everything you mentioned falls under it. Obviously you know your stuff, I think we are just using a different definition.

                                        https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/devops/learn/what-is-infrastructure-as-code

                                        RamblingBipedR 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • RamblingBipedR
                                          RamblingBiped @IRJ
                                          last edited by

                                          @IRJ The newest approach that AWS is starting to push is a declaritive language that generates CloudFormation from code.

                                          The Cloud Development Kit (CDK)

                                          It is conceptually similar to stacker, but a bit more complex. It can reduce template size by up to 70%, and allows you to do conditional provisioning of resources without the added complexity of nested conditions and inflated parameter hell.

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • RamblingBipedR
                                            RamblingBiped @IRJ
                                            last edited by

                                            @IRJ I'm just saying don't sell yourselves short. A lot of "DevOps" engineers that consider themselves as having only an Infrastructure skillset are practiced Software Engineers. Its something that almost happens organically as a result of being put into the role.

                                            IRJI ObsolesceO 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 1
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