Career Change
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Is it IT you like, or programming / software engineering?
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I completed the majority of a master's program from a respected college in NY... But after looking at the numbers I was surprised to see that, in IT, master's degrees actually earn less, on average, then people with no formal education.
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I've read articles of people with PhDs who can't buy houses because they have a million dollar education debt... Fine if you are a medical field doctor making a quarter million a year... but those aren't the only PhD holders...
I can imagine that a Masters degree is very expensive too.
So you need to make a lot of money to off-set the costs of having to pay back your school loan.
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I still have 10 months left on my school loan, but I'm not making big payments either... the interest is so low it didn't matter much.
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@jaredbusch said in Career Change:
@nerdydad said in Career Change:
I actually have a degree in IT, a Master's in fact, but it looks like I'm more of the exception to the rule than the rule itself.
You really don't need a degree to start in IT. Helpdesk is not entry into IT. It is another field of IT.
I'll quote Scott from above on some things. Start a home lab. You don't have to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on hardware and licenses. You can spend $5-10/month on Vultr or Linode, get a vm with Fedora or Debian Linux and begin building stuff.
If Linux isn't you're thing, then you might want to check out VyOS for networking and switching, or get yourself some Ubiquiti equipment and do a small network at home.
I too have a Masters in IT (will be paid off in 3 months finally), but I got that later in life when I was at AT&T and looking to move out of the Union and into Development.
Also IT from that college doens't mean IT. It means anything to do with a fucking computer.
What school did you get your degree from?
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@tim_g said in Career Change:
I've read articles of people with PhDs who can't buy houses because they have a million dollar education debt... Fine if you are a medical field doctor making a quarter million a year... but those aren't the only PhD holders...
Quarter million is a terrible income for a PhD. LOL. That's a great example of how doctors could never justify the time and cost of school.
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Obviously depends on what kind of medical doctor you are:
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Considering the salary range for IT with NO degree... IT can do way better.
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IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
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@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
Just because something is possible, doesn't mean it's like that for everyone.
Find me an SMB who will pay an IT generalist 300k... you wont. Perhaps as you said, a specialized system admin for an enterprise.
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@tim_g said in Career Change:
Find me an SMB who will pay an IT generalist 300k... you wont.
Find me that, and I'll probably do some depraved shit for that job.
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@tim_g said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
But the jobs are out there. SMB doesn't have system admins, either. That's the actual difference in pay. System Admins make good money.
But it's not just enterprises paying that. Loads of 500 and fewer companies pay in that range.
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Today I learned I did everything wrong. CIS Degree, started at minimum wage, don't make anywhere near doctor money, don't have a home lab, never post on here, and don't blog. I still work in IT, live in my hometown, make ok money, and have a good time with people I enjoy. Cheers and good luck man! Get out there and get your feet wet.
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@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@tim_g said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
But the jobs are out there. SMB doesn't have system admins, either. That's the actual difference in pay. System Admins make good money.
But it's not just enterprises paying that. Loads of 500 and fewer companies pay in that range.
yeah - you say that, but I've never seen it. I know that itself is meaningless... but I'd really like to know where these 500 or less person companies are that are paying IT 300K +
and compared to SMB IT, how many are getting that? 10% of the industry? 5%? 50% who knows?
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@dashrender said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@tim_g said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
But the jobs are out there. SMB doesn't have system admins, either. That's the actual difference in pay. System Admins make good money.
But it's not just enterprises paying that. Loads of 500 and fewer companies pay in that range.
yeah - you say that, but I've never seen it. I know that itself is meaningless... but I'd really like to know where these 500 or less person companies are that are paying IT 300K +
and compared to SMB IT, how many are getting that? 10% of the industry? 5%? 50% who knows?
Yeah, but you've but multiple people in this community that have topped those numbers
And I've known thousands getting into that range.In Silicon Valley, $300K isn't that crazy, nor in NYC. Nor in Connecticut. And I've seen it in Chicago.
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@dashrender said in Career Change:
and compared to SMB IT, how many are getting that? 10% of the industry? 5%? 50% who knows?
This is the problem... with doctors, we take the "medical field" which includes doctors, dentists, nurses, nurse practitioners, radiation techs, candystripers, etc. and we don't look at them as a whole. We look only at the top jobs, the doctors. What percentage of medical workers make over $120K? Not many.
IT is similar. Huge field with nearly everyone in it at the base of the pyramid. And if you lump in the semi-IT jobs like bench, it explodes in size.
So if you compare IT to medicine, I think you'll find that the $200K+ rates in IT might beat those in medical. Remember, enterprise admin is "doctor" in IT speak. At which point, sure, a decent percentage are under $150K. But not that many.
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Consider that those in IT getting to those pay ranges generally do so around the same age that doctors are just interning, and generally do so with a long career history of income, and no debt - or at least more income and less debt - and the numbers look better and better.
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@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@dashrender said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@tim_g said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
But the jobs are out there. SMB doesn't have system admins, either. That's the actual difference in pay. System Admins make good money.
But it's not just enterprises paying that. Loads of 500 and fewer companies pay in that range.
yeah - you say that, but I've never seen it. I know that itself is meaningless... but I'd really like to know where these 500 or less person companies are that are paying IT 300K +
and compared to SMB IT, how many are getting that? 10% of the industry? 5%? 50% who knows?
Yeah, but you've but multiple people in this community that have topped those numbers
And I've known thousands getting into that range.In Silicon Valley, $300K isn't that crazy, nor in NYC. Nor in Connecticut. And I've seen it in Chicago.
yes, but you're also talking about high cost of living places...
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@dashrender said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@dashrender said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
@tim_g said in Career Change:
@scottalanmiller said in Career Change:
IT obviously has a ridiculously large range of income that starts around minimum wage. Doctors lack that low end stuff. But when you compare high end IT, the people for whom a PhD or MD is an option, IT gets paid really high. For example, at CitiGroup, entry level system admin, no college, under two years of experience, was $105K to start and got up to $200K. And they were considered one of the lowest in the market. And that was well over a decade ago, so a lot more money by today's standards.
That's in a large company and is enterprise IT. Most of us here are SMB, and not making anywhere near 300k.
But the jobs are out there. SMB doesn't have system admins, either. That's the actual difference in pay. System Admins make good money.
But it's not just enterprises paying that. Loads of 500 and fewer companies pay in that range.
yeah - you say that, but I've never seen it. I know that itself is meaningless... but I'd really like to know where these 500 or less person companies are that are paying IT 300K +
and compared to SMB IT, how many are getting that? 10% of the industry? 5%? 50% who knows?
Yeah, but you've but multiple people in this community that have topped those numbers
And I've known thousands getting into that range.In Silicon Valley, $300K isn't that crazy, nor in NYC. Nor in Connecticut. And I've seen it in Chicago.
yes, but you're also talking about high cost of living places...
That's where doctors make the big bucks, too.
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Within the pool of doctors and nurses alone, doctors only make up 23% of that pool. And that's hardly even beginning to be the entire field of medicine.
