Backup System For 5 PC SMB
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@scottalanmiller said:
It would never have occurred to me that someone would even try this
But as I said, almost every desktop backup product that does block level or image based backups touts this as a feature.
That's why I know about it. We moved from the world of tape into the likes of this kind of abckups, most of who offer desktop options.
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Again, not arguing, just trying to get my facts straight before going back to our vendors.
It seems to me they are doing exactly what you say. Making a lot of money selling a product that isn't legal to be used.
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@BRRABill said:
Again, not arguing, just trying to get my facts straight before going back to our vendors.
It seems to me they are doing exactly what you say. Making a lot of money selling a product that isn't legal to be used.
That may be true, that's a common thing to do. Although keep in mind a few things:
- It might be legal in other places.
- The world is not all Windows and other OSes can do this legally.
- That they offer the feature is just a feature, how it relates to licensing is not their concern and they easily have no idea.
- Licensing is complex and changes, the feature could easily become useful.
- The technology has uses, just not in all the possible ways to use it.
- Their competitors offer that feature and get customers from offering it, lacking it puts a vendor at a disadvantage so they can't avoid offering it in a competitive marketplace.
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@BRRABill said:
But as I said, almost every desktop backup product that does block level or image based backups touts this as a feature.
The nature of block and image backup technologies means that this is just sitting there, waiting to be used. They would basically have to block it to cripple themselves to not offer it. The ability to restore as an image to the original machine gives them the ability to restore to others. It's just the "nature of the thing."
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The technology has its place. Imagine and block backups can be a good thing. Like virtualization, though, it often makes doing things that are not licensed usage very, very easy.
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In a perfect world though, this technology would be awesome.
The selling point of something like Datto is that is a key system goes down, I can spin up a virtual copy of it (either locally or in the cloud in a real disaster) and my users won't even know the difference.
I'm not asking to pirate the software. I'm asking to put a virtual representation of the system I've already licensed on the network until I get the original server fixed. To be honest, I feel it's complete BS that is prohibited. (For desktops.) We'll get to the servers later.
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@BRRABill said:
In a perfect world though, this technology would be awesome.
Indeed, although in a perfect world, we wouldn't need it
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@BRRABill said:
The selling point of something like Datto is that is a key system goes down, I can spin up a virtual copy of it (either locally or in the cloud in a real disaster) and my users won't even know the difference.
Yup, and if you were talking Windows servers, that would work that way. It's just for desktops. In theory, you still need a device for the users to use to access the VMs if their device has failed. So even with this technology, what does it really provide? Just restore to the new device instead of spinning one up remotely. Should be just as fast to get the new device working.
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@BRRABill said:
I'm not asking to pirate the software. I'm asking to put a virtual representation of the system I've already licensed on the network until I get the original server fixed. To be honest, I feel it's complete BS that is prohibited. (For desktops.) We'll get to the servers later.
Then I recommend Linux Mint
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I know, I know. Write my own desktop OS and license it.
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Although the question would remain and we must be missing something in your previous planning....
If you have five desktops, and one dies, and you spin one up as VDI in a cloud.... how do you access it?
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@scottalanmiller said:
If you have five desktops, and one dies, and you spin one up as VDI in a cloud.... how do you access it?
Originally I thought about using a Datto device in there. The entry level device I was thinking of does not have ability to spin up a local VM ... only in the cloud. But withiin minutes I would have a exact copy of their machine in the cloud. You can access it through the Datto device using the same IP if the local device is still there. (Wouldn't be, say, in the case of a total disaster.) This is great if the local desktop is sharing files. Or you could access it anywhere online using the IP they give you and RDP.
So in tax season, the client could keep rolling while you fixed their machine. Run out to Best Buy, buy a new machine, and do a BMR. They are down for only minutes.
The issue with this (aside from apparent licensing issues) is cost. Their rates for 7 year retention are insance. You export an image every month, but that is a lot of manual work. That's what originally brought me to this thread. To find a better way of doing this.
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@BRRABill said:
The issue with this (aside from apparent licensing issues) is cost. Their rates for 7 year retention are insance. You export an image every month, but that is a lot of manual work. That's what originally brought me to this thread. To find a better way of doing this.
Yeah, image backups are for rapid recovery, not long term retention. Use local storage and file backups for that!
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@BRRABill said:
So in tax season, the client could keep rolling while you fixed their machine. Run out to Best Buy, buy a new machine, and do a BMR. They are down for only minutes.
Why do the spin up in the cloud if you can do this, though? If you spin up in the cloud, you need a desktop from which to access the remote instance. So you are stuck until you are in a position where you could have restored to a physical machine.
All of that Datto gear is nice, but I'm not seeing a situation where you could leverage it with a VM. You'd always just restore to the new machine that you put in place, right?
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@BRRABill said:
Or you could access it anywhere online using the IP they give you and RDP.
That only works if they have another desktop to work from, though. And if they do, theoretically you are ready to restore.
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@scottalanmiller said:
That only works if they have another desktop to work from, though. And if they do, theoretically you are ready to restore.
I'd take them a laptop while I commandeered a new system for them. Or fixed the old one.
Or also this would be great if their place burned down or all machines got stolen
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Say Monday morning hits and they were robbed over the weekend. All 5 employees could be up and running at 9:15.
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Here is my understanding of how the BMR licensing works...
- Your old machine has an OEM license
- Your new machine has an OEM license
- You have purchased imaging rights so that imaging systems can be used via VL
- Old machine dies, you can use the image on the new machine. No licenses transfer, only the system image. You will need to re-authenticate.
I still don't like this idea at all, stick to a gold master image and data backup. But BMR is doable using all of the tools mentioned.
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@BRRABill said:
@scottalanmiller said:
That only works if they have another desktop to work from, though. And if they do, theoretically you are ready to restore.
I'd take them a laptop while I commandeered a new system for them. Or fixed the old one.
Or also this would be great if their place burned down or all machines got stolen
So they have backup hardware ready to go at all times that is or isn't owned by the business? The company only has five PCs, right? They would need to buy all new?
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@BRRABill said:
Say Monday morning hits and they were robbed over the weekend. All 5 employees could be up and running at 9:15.
Somehow I don't think you need that quick of a RTO.. Considering how little you are willing to spend, down time must not cost you that much.
