Cisco vs. Polycom - Phone System
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@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@JaredBusch said:
@BBigford said:
I've managed Cisco's UCS/UCM phone system in a previous environment, and I know it was really expensive. Now I'm in a network that uses Polycom, that we don't really manage all that much (we do about 90% of requests, but anything deep level we have a contract). I was asked by a director at a school district about Polycom vs. Cisco vs. Asterisk. I said Asterisk is going to be the least expensive but I didn't think his provider could port for outside calls (that's pending), and wasn't sure about cost difference between Polycom and Cisco. He also asked what the Polycom software is called (I thought it was InCom?). Does anyone have any numbers on an RFP they put out, or have gone down that road comparing Cisco to Polycom? Thanks!
Polycom is not a a phone system. So first, identify the actual phone system. If it is InCom, that is a rebrandable IP PBX.
Either way, move to Asterisk. The provider is not relevant to that decision.
The decision for What PBX to use is never part of the decision for a provider unless you choose a proprietary provider that uses their own PBX thus technically not even giving you a choice.
Asterisk, or any other modern IP PBX, can connect to any type of trunk you choose to use. Obviously, some trunk types require hardware to interface from the physical to the IP, but there is a device for every scenario out there.
The management console is indeed InCom. I know Polycom is just the hardware, for purposes I just said Polycom because I really don't know much about it to call it something else (like Cisco UCS/UCM..) If someone could correct me (Polycom PBX?) I'd use that in my questions instead.
I just went to Polycom's website to look this up and their main website is a 404 right now. You get their "select your country" portal, select "United States" and.... page not found.
Heh, that is very re-assuring... I'll ask about Asterisk again. Not sure if that is a dead end where he is at. There's a monopoly on the small town he's in with one provider and I remember TDS (provider) explicitly telling him they don't allow an Asterisk setup to go outbound. Maybe there was a miscommunication but they were pretty clear about that. I'll ask again though because obviously free is good.
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@BBigford said:
I had little input for him and wasn't finding anything concrete online for InCom/Polycom vs. Cisco.
That's why, because they are different animals. InCom is a hosted PBX. Polycom makes the handsets for any system you want. Cisco does a top to bottom integrated system. So comparing them is not a simple thing. Cisco could be compared against Avaya or Shoretel for example, because all of them offer a complete package of everything from the phone through the PBX.
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@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@JaredBusch said:
@BBigford said:
I've managed Cisco's UCS/UCM phone system in a previous environment, and I know it was really expensive. Now I'm in a network that uses Polycom, that we don't really manage all that much (we do about 90% of requests, but anything deep level we have a contract). I was asked by a director at a school district about Polycom vs. Cisco vs. Asterisk. I said Asterisk is going to be the least expensive but I didn't think his provider could port for outside calls (that's pending), and wasn't sure about cost difference between Polycom and Cisco. He also asked what the Polycom software is called (I thought it was InCom?). Does anyone have any numbers on an RFP they put out, or have gone down that road comparing Cisco to Polycom? Thanks!
Polycom is not a a phone system. So first, identify the actual phone system. If it is InCom, that is a rebrandable IP PBX.
Either way, move to Asterisk. The provider is not relevant to that decision.
The decision for What PBX to use is never part of the decision for a provider unless you choose a proprietary provider that uses their own PBX thus technically not even giving you a choice.
Asterisk, or any other modern IP PBX, can connect to any type of trunk you choose to use. Obviously, some trunk types require hardware to interface from the physical to the IP, but there is a device for every scenario out there.
The management console is indeed InCom. I know Polycom is just the hardware, for purposes I just said Polycom because I really don't know much about it to call it something else (like Cisco UCS/UCM..) If someone could correct me (Polycom PBX?) I'd use that in my questions instead.
I just went to Polycom's website to look this up and their main website is a 404 right now. You get their "select your country" portal, select "United States" and.... page not found.
Heh, that is very re-assuring... I'll ask about Asterisk again. Not sure if that is a dead end where he is at. There's a monopoly on the small town he's in with one provider and I remember TDS (provider) explicitly telling him they don't allow an Asterisk setup to go outbound. Maybe there was a miscommunication but they were pretty clear about that. I'll ask again though because obviously free is good.
This is generally do to collusion. The phone provider might be in bed with Cisco and intentionally seeking out and detecting competitor's products and attempting to block them. At the end of the day, though SIP is SIP and you can't tell who is connected. Just like with a website, HTTP is HTTP, you can respond with what web server you are using or you can choose not to. It only causes a problem if one side is intentionally blocking some clients.
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@mlnews said:
@BBigford said:
I had little input for him and wasn't finding anything concrete online for InCom/Polycom vs. Cisco.
That's why, because they are different animals. InCom is a hosted PBX. Polycom makes the handsets for any system you want. Cisco does a top to bottom integrated system. So comparing them is not a simple thing. Cisco could be compared against Avaya or Shoretel for example, because all of them offer a complete package of everything from the phone through the PBX.
Ok, that's where I was getting confused. I was thinking Polycom had a top to bottom solution like Cisco and Shoretel, but obviously that is not the case. So where we use InCom, serviced by a company called CTC... You can buy Polycom hardware, go with a variation of backend services (beyond InCom) and is managed either internally or through a provider like CTC? Is that right or am I off somewhere...?
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Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
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@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
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@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Wait, are you not on VoIP? That's the issue. Can you not move to modern telephony? I can come to your town and would never even know TDS existed because I'm on VoIP and my phone lines come with me anywhere. TDS has nothing to do with my phone lines.
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@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Been there done that. Can the numbers get ported to a different provider? IE could you go pure SIP for this?
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@BBigford said:
He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Like many things in the Internet era.... what would make you even consider a local provider let alone select one? not that there aren't reasons why it wouldn't make sense, I'm not saying that. But local would be the last place I would consider. I would want the best service, flexibility and options. Local almost always means bad things - like treating customers like crap because they assume that they are valuing locality over quality or value.
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Check out Vitelity they generally have local DIDs wherever you are. http://www.vitelity.com/local_did_coverage/
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@BBigford said:
"Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers...
Dollars to donuts you put in Asterisk and they couldn't even figure it out. As to the porting, they are simply lying there. They aren't porting at all. Porting would refer to transferring you to another phone company.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Wait, are you not on VoIP? That's the issue. Can you not move to modern telephony? I can come to your town and would never even know TDS existed because I'm on VoIP and my phone lines come with me anywhere. TDS has nothing to do with my phone lines.
Right. Just received an email.. He wanted a provider (who he's migrate to) to host the phone service, but they told him that they didn't have the rights to port the numbers. He talked about possibly having to convert his POTS lines to PRI and see how many numbers he can port...
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@coliver said:
Check out Vitelity they generally have local DIDs wherever you are. http://www.vitelity.com/local_did_coverage/
As well well as voip.ms and VoicePulse.
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@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Wait, are you not on VoIP? That's the issue. Can you not move to modern telephony? I can come to your town and would never even know TDS existed because I'm on VoIP and my phone lines come with me anywhere. TDS has nothing to do with my phone lines.
Right. Just received an email.. He wanted a provider (who he's migrate to) to host the phone service, but they told him that they didn't have the rights to port the numbers. He talked about possibly having to convert his POTS lines to PRI and see how many numbers he can port...
Drop the numbers, that's your best bet. You are being held hostage and every day you leave the numbers there they have you more and more hostage. Move to new numbers immediately and slowly phase people over. Get them on your website immediately. The cost of staying with this provider is already huge and will only grow over time. You are locked into a ridiculous system and are already being extorted.
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@scottalanmiller said:
Porting would refer to transferring you to another phone company.
I guess that's what he is trying to accomplish after all. I think this thread might be a jumble of miscommunication now. Haha sorry for that. Started off as one thing and seems like it is just going in a loop.
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@BBigford said:
Right. Just received an email.. He wanted a provider (who he's migrate to) to host the phone service, but they told him that they didn't have the rights to port the numbers.
"They" always have the right to port. What they mean to tell you is they "don't have a legal requirement to port" so they won't because they have you trapped. Why would they give that up?
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@BBigford said:
He talked about possibly having to convert his POTS lines to PRI and see how many numbers he can port...
That's not porting, that's just locking in more and more.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Wait, are you not on VoIP? That's the issue. Can you not move to modern telephony? I can come to your town and would never even know TDS existed because I'm on VoIP and my phone lines come with me anywhere. TDS has nothing to do with my phone lines.
Right. Just received an email.. He wanted a provider (who he's migrate to) to host the phone service, but they told him that they didn't have the rights to port the numbers. He talked about possibly having to convert his POTS lines to PRI and see how many numbers he can port...
Drop the numbers, that's your best bet. You are being held hostage and every day you leave the numbers there they have you more and more hostage. Move to new numbers immediately and slowly phase people over. Get them on your website immediately. The cost of staying with this provider is already huge and will only grow over time. You are locked into a ridiculous system and are already being extorted.
This is probably going to be your only option. Small telcoms seem to be holding onto their local exchanges with a death grip I have no idea why other companies aren't bringing competition in.
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So.... what is trapping you with your current numbers? Is it that customers already know them? You have advertised them heavily? What makes you unable to change your phone numbers?
This is common, I'm just trying to work out your unique strategy here.
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@coliver said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
@BBigford said:
@scottalanmiller said:
Let's back up a little. Instead of only looking at the phones it sounds like there is an issue with a bad provider. What provider are you using and how are you limited to them? How are they achieving lock in?
It's a provider called TDS (tdstelecom I believe). When he inquired about going with an Asterisk setup, the provider said "Nope, nope. You can't use Asterisk with us. You have to use a setup like Cisco." I was told it was how they port the numbers... He's limited to them because there is literally NO other company in the area. There is one single company that services all the surrounding towns within about a 40-45 mile radius...
Wait, are you not on VoIP? That's the issue. Can you not move to modern telephony? I can come to your town and would never even know TDS existed because I'm on VoIP and my phone lines come with me anywhere. TDS has nothing to do with my phone lines.
Right. Just received an email.. He wanted a provider (who he's migrate to) to host the phone service, but they told him that they didn't have the rights to port the numbers. He talked about possibly having to convert his POTS lines to PRI and see how many numbers he can port...
Drop the numbers, that's your best bet. You are being held hostage and every day you leave the numbers there they have you more and more hostage. Move to new numbers immediately and slowly phase people over. Get them on your website immediately. The cost of staying with this provider is already huge and will only grow over time. You are locked into a ridiculous system and are already being extorted.
This is probably going to be your only option. Small telcoms seem to be holding onto their local exchanges with a death grip I have no idea why other companies aren't bringing competition in.
Because they literally own the customers and there is no way to compete. It is actually a legal monopoly and there is no way out but to abandon the numbers.
